Let’s introduce communist quotas instead of increasing our wage to so that our prices compensate for the supply demand of labour. These oligarchs are really hate the idea of raising wages that much now that they can’t have imported slave labour.
If only it came with a few more aspects of maoism. Like the obliteration of landlords
Judging by how hard the GOP is fighting to protect the Epstein files, they have some other things in common with Mao.
they have some other things in common with Mao.
Evidence?
do you have sources about the mao side of this?
You mean a wanton disregard for the will of the people right?..…Right Annikin?
Nope. It’s slavery. They want to do a slavery.
Hint: Marxist-Leninists really like slavery, so that’s not a distinguishing factor.
I think the big difference would be that under this you’d probably be working for next to nothing to enrich Monsanto or something, whereas under a Socialist system these would be public lands owned by the people, do be distributed to the people.
Having the military do farm work/construction is also pretty common in those kind of countries too.
And not even smart. Farming today is sonething you have to train at and want / need to do. Grab 100 people that have never farmed before and set them loose in a field to find out how quickly crops burn.
Who’s the “our” in “our farms” referring to? 👀
You know…good people. (Pay no attention to the fact that the definition of good people changes wildly every day based on the moods and whims of Dear Leader.)
A very good point.
…right , so only the family farms? Not any farm owned by a corporation, right?
I was thinking more like “farms collectively owned by the populace”…
BRB, gonna go kill a few sparrows
Before you go melt your pans.
Need the pans to catch the sparrows bruh
Sparrows first, then pans
Make it so the farmer has to pay the median wage to anyone drafted like this.
I bet they’ll shut up real fast.
Hell back in HS we got first shot at detasseling corn and deroguing beans. I lasted a day, some boys lasted a few. By the time they brought in the mexicans a week later, there would be maybe 2 of the scariest foodball players left, and they did make decent money by the end of their little stint.
Your average person is going to get heatstroke from this.
not the worst idea really; community or civil service would be better. especially outside the town you’re from.
my high school made everyone do 40 hours community service and the connections and friends I made then still stand today and I live thousands of miles away now
Forced labor is never a good idea. Best solution for the kids would be to coordinate with others and burn all the fields in conjunction. Would bring the country to its knees begging other countries for assistance with food. The government would likely collapse and give up on the forced labor as soon as possible.
“The slaves acted like terrorists.”
It’s not like they had a choice what country they were born in.
yea not forced labor on farms - i’d propose local community service, help the town out, administer local elections, vfw, or local hospital or something more civic based.
I liked more when it was volunteer community service to gain access to a higher level of scholarship option. 75% scholarships didn’t require volunteer work, 100% scholarships did. No one is forced to do anything, but you can choose to do so and it benefits your options.
tieing it to scholarship is difficult because you’re gonna end up with a bunch of nerdy guys who have the palest skin you’ve ever seen standing in the middle of texan sun … not ideal.
the his was actually the reason but the high school also mandated it. to be honest a lot of kids ended up just working with their parents and getting away with that sadly. 100% agreed with you
Ah, they didn’t allow the working with a family member in Florida. Had to do a non-profit or government program. Although I know 2 people who got around that by volunteering to do the clock/statkeeping for the kids basketball games. They’d show up on Saturday every weekend so the parents and such didn’t have to do it. And being that they both played basketball, it fit their interests and they noted all the individual stats instead of just the total score. The leagues are non-profit so it was an easier one.
that’s how it should be. lolol stop clock is a lottery win for those 2
I see where you’re coming from but I disagree.
I think society would always benefit from requiring some sort of community service. Its a great way of getting people involved I’m the real grit of their community. Build fond memories with friends and learn life lessons while making a difference.
Now, granted, I’m not going to go quietly into the fields to fix a mess made by a fascist government who decided making a show of shipping off undesirables is more important than eating.
Nor am I going to do such labor for free/cheap against my will and then be told
“Oh I’m so sorry. Jolly Green Giant and Kroger have had a bad year so that broccoli you picked has to double in price”
So what I’m saying is, I would be completely on board with a mandatory community harvest effort, but that’s assuming its for a government that hasn’t disgusted me or broken my trust. Which, as an American, I don’t have that.
So… you want to bring back the WPA? I’ve been in favor of that idea since the 1990s. It should never have ended.
Yes, thank you for defining for those who didn’t already know.
I’m going to go out on a limb here, and guess that Kelly is over 30?
/ owns a farm and doesn’t realize the logistics of training tens of thousands of new farm hands who do not want to be there every season.
You know, you have to have a solid, repeatable plan for farm success, 5 years sounds about right.
1 Maoism
2 ???
3 wait 30 years
4 economy multiplies to 10000x it’s original sizeI dunno, the math is pretty compelling
This is what MAO did during the cultural revolution. Intellectuals and ‘professionals’ got sent to work in the communes. Hard to believe that MAGAts are asking for commmnist policies, but then the Kirk thing has surprised me in terms of the policies they want now. Since Kirks policies are no longer acceptable?
They nationalized Intel for chrissakes (ok, partially) and are or have done the same with TikTok. It’s like they’re doing a bass ackwards play at the horshoe theory. Anything to avoid the middle at Capitalist Socialism.
i think supporting intel was a mistake. intel produces cutting-edge chips, unlike ARM which is significantly cheaper and catching on to intel performance-wise.
Basically, intel can’t continue because they’re at their natural end of life: with the end of moore’s law, it’s only a matter of time till ARM catches up performance-wise, and out-competes them on price.
with the end of moore’s law, it’s only a matter of time till ARM catches up performance-wise, and out-competes them on price.
I’m not so sure about that, at least in single-thread applications, but I’m also not sure it matters. When performance reaches a certain point the average consumer doesn’t really need more. And I think we’ve largely reached that point for the average consumer.
When performance reaches a certain point the average consumer doesn’t really need more. And I think we’ve largely reached that point for the average consumer.
yep
It makes sense when you understand that MAGA doesn’t really have a ideological base. They are a group of people pissed off on the economic prospects of their lives without having any real understanding on how to fix it.
When you choose your words, you can get a MAGA to be 1000% aggreeable on the “libtard” views they rail against every day. I do it every day and I’m not exaggerating.
Is it possible to learn this power?
People deep in MAGA usually focus on words or phrases as bad, not going deep into the ideas of it. If you can discuss something without bringing up those words or phrases, you can probably get them to agree to something.
Though the goals were different. Intellectuals weren’t sent from their labor, they were sent to get re-educated because Mao thought they were too bougie.
MAGA’s woke is pretty close to Mao’s or Stalin’s bougie.
History doesn’t repeat itself, but it often rhymes.
Or, and hear me out here: We could pay people a competitive wage for their labor.
I understand the need for agricultural subsidies. The government inserts itself into the normal supply/demand process to protect the general public against a famine.
What I don’t understand is why those subsidies don’t seem to be flowing past the greedy hands of corporate farmers and into the pockets of farm laborers.
you can’t have competitive wages on a free market as long as somebody else is willing to do it for less. That’s why migrant labor would have to end first.
Tbh, I’m not convinced that this would really happen. There’s not that much price elasticity to a lot of agricultural products. If the strawberries cost too much, most people will just not be able to afford strawberries and thus will just not buy them but instead buy less labour-intensive produce instead.
One could argue that if strawberries cannot be produced in a way that earns everyone involved a living wage then we shouldn’t produce strawberries, and that’s a totally valid point to argue.
It’s also fair to argue that we need to cut out capitalism’s inherent inefficiency of having to feed the capitalists in the process who did contributed nothing in terms of labour. But on the one hand, this hasn’t worked out that great in the past and on the other hand this would require more of a change than to just kick out migrants.
What would be more likely to happen (since we’ve seen it happen during Covid already) is that the wages will go up, but the locals still won’t do the work, thus strawberries will rot on the fields, the shelves will be empty, the prices will go up, but not enough to cover the losses for the farmers and the farmers will plant something less labour-intense next season.
(Wages would have to go way, way up before people will voluntarily quit their job in an AC’d office to work on a field.)
Didn’t we try that here after Brexit? From what I remember, farmers were having to let crops go to waste because Brits didn’t want the jobs, even after wages were raised. Most farm work is seasonal, people don’t really want that instability.
Edit: https://foodwastestories.com/2021/10/09/120000-pigs-culled/
They had to bring in special visas, because no one else wanted the jobs.
yeah, there’s a serious argument to be made here that the people in england, USA simply don’t want these kinds of jobs.
then again, the thing isn’t so simple. Why would people in the USA not want these jobs, but mexicans are fine with them? is it because the people are spoiled? is it for other reasons?
Personally, the job itself I wouldn’t mind, but it’s what comes with it. It’s seasonal work. How would I consistently support myself outside the season? How would I get a stable home if I’m living in farm accommodation while working?
In the UK at least, these were often men coming in from the EU. They could send money back home to their families, where it would go further.
A resident Brit with kids to support isn’t going to go for this kind of job. As I said, no stability. They’d have to pay enough to make up for months of no work over winter. Which they can’t do as their margins are already low and supermarkets don’t pay enough and so much produce goes to waste because it’s a bit blemished or wonky.
Sounds like they didn’t raise wages enough to fairly compensate workers for tolerating that instability.
Actually I don’t think it’s that terrible for an idea, as long as things like food and accommodations are provided, and you can’t get out of it by paying (e.g. pay someone to do it for you).
I’d like to see billionaires doing hard labor alongside ordinary people.
If we’re doing it, we gotta add in a rotation of frontline retail/restaurant work.
How about we just add it to curriculum for school. During general highschool educational, you must take at least one Public Service class per year. You can choose from farming, retail, plumbing, electrician, road crew, et cetera. Each kid has to do a certain number of hour per school year, and it’s required even if private school kids. Disability would obviously be an exception, but otherwise you need to be doing at least X number of hours per school year to graduate. Could help people understand how these things work, and hopefully build some empathy in the little sociopaths.
If you think this is truly beneficial you should be able to hire people to do it. If you can’t convince people to do this what right do you have to force them?
Could also steer some kids into trades instead of expensive college that isn’t a good fit for them.
A well rounded graduate of highschool, having experienced multiple different kinds of work environments could help our society feel a little more connected, lead to kids better able to determine what it is they want to do with their lives. If you had to do this once per year during highschool, and you had to pick a different one each year, you’d end up with at least 4 different experiences by the end. That’s a lot better than our current system of “you’ve never been allowed to make a decision before. Now, my child, on your 18th year, decide your career for the rest of your life, and blindly take our 200 thousand dollars worth of loans to do it”
I’m able to have a sense of empathy for all those people you listed, without having done every single one of them personally. I don’t know what the best way to teach empathy is, however.
You can get out of it by paying
See The Rich doing hard labor
Pick one
I would agree with it if it was working on publicly owned farms. I don’t support any kind of “drafted” labor that ultimately benefits private owners, or even a system where the government reaps the profits. If people are made to work in any fashion, every cent of value generated should go back to them.
We are not slaves. Fuck off. If your business can’t survive, then you go out of business.
deleted by creator
If your nation is too poor to afford the food it grows then you’re already fucked.
deleted by creator
Shouldn’t you be able to tell me if you already have a conclusion?
deleted by creator
If all you can provide is a seed, how can I trust it’s worth the effort, cost and risk of growing?
deleted by creator
But think of the exposure you’ll get!
- Exposure to sunburn
- Exposure to insect bites
- Exposure to the elements
- Exposure to pesticides and agriculture chemicals
Great. We all say this about the service industry, too. So since farming is your life blood you think its hard and people need to understand.
By that logic, everyone should be drafted for many different vocations to gain perspective on other people’s careers.
Edit: Also it seems she’s implying that someone else will pay the wages if she wants a draft. She wouldn’t have to rely on imported employees if she payed a living wage to begin with.
I don’t think this is a bad idea. Have young people do a 2 year service in let’s say, three month periods, in different socially important sectors like health, public space maintenance, care of the disadvantaged, forest maintenace, etc. chosen at random. It would help people realize a lot of things about the society we live in.
By what logic do you jump from this would benefit people to we should force people to spend their time doing this under penalty of law? Why should people do this instead of continue to further their actual life or education? Why should people do what can’t be well paid work instead of earning actual money?
It would help people realize a lot of things about the society we live in
i.e. this falls under education
You are basically talking about adding 2 years to high school, a full 50% increase in duration, with very little benefit compared to enrolling in college.
The questions I asked which you didn’t bother to answer is why should they do this instead of higher paying work or college and why should we force people to do it.
Explaining again HOW you intend to temporarily enslave people eg make it part of school isn’t particularly informative.
with very little benefit compared to enrolling in college
I think this is the main point of contention. I think it would be more beneficial for everyone to have broader hands-on knowledge, particularly in areas that are relevant to all of our lives (e.g. farming). Even if we don’t end up making a living in those areas, we live in a democracy where we have a say in many decisions that would affect these industries. Knowing more means being able to make more informed decisions and being less vulnerable to grifters trying to sway you.
The fact that you think this doesn’t justify slavery
We can agree that slavery is bad. As are many other things.
If we can make a choice that minimizes the total amount of bad, should we take it? I think yes.
If minimizing the total amount of bad involves shuffling things around so that there’s more of some bad things and less of others? That’s where it can be debatable, and I think that’s what you’re getting at. It depends on how bad you think each bad thing is. Perhaps you’re more concerned about slavery and autonomy. I’m personally more concerned about equity and having a high floor to everyone’s quality of life.
I don’t disagree at all. Gives kids a little nibble of different sectors before they commit their lives to one. Not to mention the hard work, and perspective you gain by doing so.
Everyone should have experienced working retail. That should reduce the amount of Karen’s massively!
You’d think so, but I had a colleague who boasted about how rude she was to a retail worker. This colleague was a fellow minimum wage sales assistant. Some people are just entitled little pricks who want all the respect, but aren’t willing to reciprocate.
