Because literally none of us gives one damn shit what the difference between a deacon and a priest is. They’re both trying to sell everyone the idea that they’re magical friend in the sky wants all of us to obey a bunch of rules that were written almost two thousand years ago and contradict themselves constantly.
I bet it would shock you to find out that the existence or lack thereof of an Abrahamic god is irrelevant to me.
Or, to use crayon terms: It really doesn’t matter to how I live my life if He exists or not. I choose to live as if He does and it has benefited me immensely. If somehow direct material proof of the nonexistence of god appeared tomorrow, or even the opposite, I will still live my life as I have been.
My main point is that the abandonment of cultural sacredness is why we are descending into fascism right now and you whiny little ratheists are a big part of the reason
You really have no idea how many progressive Christians you piss off with your wide-assed brush you keep painting us with
I’m not religious, but it was cringe because they were reveling in thier ignorance right before paroting common online reductions of faith. “Obey your sky daddy’s rules” and all that. Seems trite. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
my theory is the oppression religious arrogance is now getting its comeuppance. everyone who grew up with religion can now talk freely about how fucking stupid it is without their father or mother whupping their ass–theres no surprise to this.
what the fuck are you even on about? Religion has been trash talked pretty consistently since the 90s
I have an alternate hypothesis: atheism is the first rebellion, a private rebellion, as all the simmering resentment of being under their parents’ thumb is transferred to the ultimate example of authority. They attribute every shortcoming of perceived justice (remember they are kids, their concept of justice is ‘I should be treated special’) on the head of an apparently absent, indifferent, or even malicious god.
And the ‘freedom’ of being finally able to shout out against that perceived indifferent authority brings a sense of heady and powerful liberty like baby’s first beer
And I think young atheists get addicted to that thrill, to be able to shout out against power, but just like every other addiction you never quite get the same thrill as that first delicious moment of rebellion
So they have to start finding it elsewhere, and usually it’s arguing with theists because frankly, it’s easy to do and win. they define ‘win’ being as ‘upsetting the theist while appearing intellectual’ and practice a set of boilerplate arguments quick-tabbed to whip out at any of several theological conversation hooks
The problem with that is, again it’s an addiction. It makes people do stupid things to satisfy it, like saying incorrect things with undeserved boldness
no ones shouting against religion, theres too much risk being assaulted by some zealot. people are just talking about it on the internet. and for the record. religious people literally go door to door to influence us, they are the reason why we have anti-abortion laws, they are the reason why trans people have to fucking hide their identity for fear of being murdered, they are the reason we have wars.
people talk a lot about 9.11 and how islam is to blame. people talk about how ww2 was about targeting Jewish people. religions literally cause wars. its not real. and people who defend it are silly stupid heads with poopy on their heads (kidding here, I know plenty of spiritual people who are kind and great) but the evil out weights the good.
you have some good points and i respect that. but i–grown under a strict religious parental figure do not understand how people cant wrap their head around your concept of disrespect of religious things. if god brings you peace of mind, thats awesome. just don’t force it on anyone else
and people who defend it are silly stupid heads with poopy on their heads
Fuck off in every way you are capable of, then fund a study group to discover new and interesting ways to fuck off, then do them
All at once.
I am so fuckdamn tired of this constant casual marginalization, the abandonment of the sacred culturally is 50% of the reason we are descending into fascism and yet you rancid heathens sit there all smug in your own pile of rhetorical shit thinking it is progress
There were once concepts in our culture that were unassailable, protection for women and children, the enshrinement of personal privacy, and of universal human dignity.
The thing is, ALL of these protections rolled down from the idea that ‘Human life is sacred because it is a creation of God’, and A WHOLE FUCKTONNE of our Bill of Rights are based on this (despite what all of you whiny separation of powers people claim), so when you unroll the idea of God, then anything that was protected is now subject to attack
But you will whine ‘Nonono Angry_Autist, it was those evil Skybeard believing repugnicans that overturned RvWade!’
Only because they knew that no one holds womens’ rights scared anymore, because no one holds ANYTHING sacred anymore, because without an objective measure of ethical good, everything is just relative cultural custom and just as unimportant.
You can SEE that in how ambivalent they are over the rising number of innocent women dying from easily treated miscarriage complications
But STILL you don’t understand just how devastating descending into moral relativism has been, and will fight against ANYONE who tries to show you your complicity in the current era of strife
“all men were created equally–oh except black people we are enslaving them” didnt thomas jefferson fuck his slaves and keep his own children as slaves or some shit?
the never ending hypocrisy from religion is why you get what you get. No longer getting graded on a curve is not persecution. you are just fragile. Also please, take it easy. im not against you. I think religion has many good things in them, but when christian schools have mass graves in them from the aboriginals they kidnapped they deserve a bit if scrutiny, right? when muslim schools destroy gays, when ethno-religious states conduct genocide? it deserves some scrutiny and shouldn’t be surprised when people talk about it.
i think religion has a very large part with racism.
well I don’t think you are a piece of shit and im sorry if I offended you in anyway. I don’t want to turn this into a shit throwing show. you have some good points, and I don’t think religion is all bad . I just dont think its criticized as badly as people think. I know very spiritual people who are great. I also know bad. But if we don’t talk about the bad with the good progress doesn’t happen
And I think your opinions are malformed and bigoted
People like you mistake the impulse for religion as the impulse to abuse. You think the purpose of the church is to protect abusers and that every product of it is tainted by this association
Abusers seek power wherever, the same impulse that drives pedos to enter the clergy is the same impulse that drives hollywood producers and politicians to seek the power to abuse. Per capita, even if you tripled the discovery rate to include clergy not caught, your kid is still safer with a priest than with a politician or a producer but every single time people will insist ‘religion bad because bad things done by religious people’, yet still support hollywood with their dollars and politicians with their support and votes.
But you and people like you conflate the abuse with the religious impulse and it has caused a ridiculous amount of harm including putting innocent people in danger
You are also trying to separate artificially religion and spirituality but that is really only a trick to focus on mainstream religions while giving new age philosophies a free pass. They are the same impulse: a seeking for a thing greater and ultimately unknowable
Look I know why Christianity leaves a bad taste in people’s mouths, all those ‘god hates fags’ sign wavers and the conservative hypocrites that would deport Jesus the moment he came back. And I guarantee you that I find them significantly more disgusting than any of you heathens could muster because they should KNOW better…
History is basically thousands of years of horrors during which people mostly believes their deity approved of all the awful things they did. It isnt the decline of the sacred that opened up this particular can of worms.
If anything its a swing towards authoritianism as a reaction to a whole host of factors.
Changing demographics making white people and men afraid of losing their privileged position
Decline in relegion making the remaining faithful fearful of living in a world where most disagree with them
Apathy on the left due to left wing figures desire not to rock the boat and pwrsue real change
Centralization of media by a handful of people with interests more aligned with the right followed by decades of brainwashing
A characteristic figure to be the focus of the above
Rising inequality to put pressure on the common folks.
Its weird to live in a world where the atheists overwhelmingly voted for normalcy and the devout voted 70% for fascism and still see godless people blamed for what you voted for.
Sorry about not knowing the intricacies of your imaginary friend’s club. BTW, claiming that your imaginary friend is the only one that’s real is pretty arrogant too.
Both are ordained ministers, the preist just leads the parish, and the deacon helps the preist lead a parish. Hierarchically they are adjacent. Why are you so confident of my religion?
Basically your side believes in 100 kinds of magic and fairy tales, at least in America the majority of self described Christians believe that the earth is less than 10k years old wished into being by what amounts to a prick of a genie and a non trivial minority of these folks believe the Earth is flat.
After spending their life talking to believers who might as well be actual adult Santa worshippers its easy to be both arrogant and a bit confused by the non imaginary part of the holy heirarchy.
Let’s go back to where you believe decline in religion has led us to fascism when 70% of Christians voted for a fascist take over of our society and 90% of atheists voted against?
Are you going to pivot to the no true Scotsman fallacy or go somewhere else with it?
I don’t recall ever saying that a decline in religion lead to any of that. Literally all I said was that Reddit Atheism is more “edgy and tryhard” than it is helpful, if you somehow got “Abandoning religion did this.” from that, I don’t know what to say.
I just don’t think it’s fair to say it’s uniquely a Christian problem that lead to fascism taking over America, especially when there are tons of “New Atheists” who are down with Jordan Peterson and other pseudo-intellectuals offering “Trans bad, upvotes to the Left” disguised as “Totally getting it bro”
Are you saying “Edgelords LARPing Atheism into a Religion” implies that somehow? Because what I mean by that is the tendency for so-called “Reddit Atheists” to treat Atheism like a Dogmatic Religion…
Sorry no, you are wrong. But that’s understandable considering how actively ignorant atheists are about what actually happens in churches
My only question is why so fuckdamn many of you are ALSO so arrogant about it
Because literally none of us gives one damn shit what the difference between a deacon and a priest is. They’re both trying to sell everyone the idea that they’re magical friend in the sky wants all of us to obey a bunch of rules that were written almost two thousand years ago and contradict themselves constantly.
Some day when you grow up you are gonna cringe so hard over this post that I almost want to screencap it for when you eventually delete it
You have an imaginary friend, and you’re trying to defend him on the internet…
I bet it would shock you to find out that the existence or lack thereof of an Abrahamic god is irrelevant to me.
Or, to use crayon terms: It really doesn’t matter to how I live my life if He exists or not. I choose to live as if He does and it has benefited me immensely. If somehow direct material proof of the nonexistence of god appeared tomorrow, or even the opposite, I will still live my life as I have been.
My main point is that the abandonment of cultural sacredness is why we are descending into fascism right now and you whiny little ratheists are a big part of the reason
You really have no idea how many progressive Christians you piss off with your wide-assed brush you keep painting us with
Not Abrahamic, still imaginary. Still cringe.
The only thing ‘cringe’ here is you using cringe unironically post-COVID
No, imaginary friends are cringe, so that too.
I’m not shocked, because based on your posts, I have no reason to care what you think.
And yet you replied
You just like arguing, a shame you aren’t very good at it
Well all you little bitches can just turn the other cheek.
Well you certainly saw what happens when they didn’t turn up to vote. Congrats
Why do you think that is cringe? I wouldn’t have thought so at 14 or at 44
I’m not religious, but it was cringe because they were reveling in thier ignorance right before paroting common online reductions of faith. “Obey your sky daddy’s rules” and all that. Seems trite. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Them: “I don’t care about your religion”
You: “Omg you’re gonna look sooooo stupid.”
If your only counter argument is a spongebob meme then maybe you want to think on what I said about maturity for a moment.
Aww who are we kidding, everyone knows you’re a perpetual child
… SpongeBob?
It’s so cute when they play stupid
I don’t think you’re playing at it, to be clear. You literally fabricated a SpongeBob reference so you could win an argument we weren’t even having.
Good job.
LoL, the arrogance of this comment is absolutely hilarious. I’m GenX. I’ve been through all of it with religion. The only cringe here is you.
Because everyone can tell you’re deliberately getting hung up on a technical inaccuracy not relevant to the issue to derail the conversation.
I guess accuracy is only important in your opposition, gotcha
Don’t let it ever be said that heathens aren’t hypocritical as well
Things are important when they matter. What’s keeping you from telling us why it matters in this instance? Cmon educate those heathens.
my theory is the oppression religious arrogance is now getting its comeuppance. everyone who grew up with religion can now talk freely about how fucking stupid it is without their father or mother whupping their ass–theres no surprise to this.
what the fuck are you even on about? Religion has been trash talked pretty consistently since the 90s
I have an alternate hypothesis: atheism is the first rebellion, a private rebellion, as all the simmering resentment of being under their parents’ thumb is transferred to the ultimate example of authority. They attribute every shortcoming of perceived justice (remember they are kids, their concept of justice is ‘I should be treated special’) on the head of an apparently absent, indifferent, or even malicious god.
And the ‘freedom’ of being finally able to shout out against that perceived indifferent authority brings a sense of heady and powerful liberty like baby’s first beer
And I think young atheists get addicted to that thrill, to be able to shout out against power, but just like every other addiction you never quite get the same thrill as that first delicious moment of rebellion
So they have to start finding it elsewhere, and usually it’s arguing with theists because frankly, it’s easy to do and win. they define ‘win’ being as ‘upsetting the theist while appearing intellectual’ and practice a set of boilerplate arguments quick-tabbed to whip out at any of several theological conversation hooks
The problem with that is, again it’s an addiction. It makes people do stupid things to satisfy it, like saying incorrect things with undeserved boldness
no ones shouting against religion, theres too much risk being assaulted by some zealot. people are just talking about it on the internet. and for the record. religious people literally go door to door to influence us, they are the reason why we have anti-abortion laws, they are the reason why trans people have to fucking hide their identity for fear of being murdered, they are the reason we have wars.
people talk a lot about 9.11 and how islam is to blame. people talk about how ww2 was about targeting Jewish people. religions literally cause wars. its not real. and people who defend it are silly stupid heads with poopy on their heads (kidding here, I know plenty of spiritual people who are kind and great) but the evil out weights the good.
you have some good points and i respect that. but i–grown under a strict religious parental figure do not understand how people cant wrap their head around your concept of disrespect of religious things. if god brings you peace of mind, thats awesome. just don’t force it on anyone else
Fuck off in every way you are capable of, then fund a study group to discover new and interesting ways to fuck off, then do them
All at once.
I am so fuckdamn tired of this constant casual marginalization, the abandonment of the sacred culturally is 50% of the reason we are descending into fascism and yet you rancid heathens sit there all smug in your own pile of rhetorical shit thinking it is progress
There were once concepts in our culture that were unassailable, protection for women and children, the enshrinement of personal privacy, and of universal human dignity.
The thing is, ALL of these protections rolled down from the idea that ‘Human life is sacred because it is a creation of God’, and A WHOLE FUCKTONNE of our Bill of Rights are based on this (despite what all of you whiny separation of powers people claim), so when you unroll the idea of God, then anything that was protected is now subject to attack
But you will whine ‘Nonono Angry_Autist, it was those evil Skybeard believing repugnicans that overturned RvWade!’
Only because they knew that no one holds womens’ rights scared anymore, because no one holds ANYTHING sacred anymore, because without an objective measure of ethical good, everything is just relative cultural custom and just as unimportant.
You can SEE that in how ambivalent they are over the rising number of innocent women dying from easily treated miscarriage complications
But STILL you don’t understand just how devastating descending into moral relativism has been, and will fight against ANYONE who tries to show you your complicity in the current era of strife
holy crap take it easy.
“all men were created equally–oh except black people we are enslaving them” didnt thomas jefferson fuck his slaves and keep his own children as slaves or some shit?
the never ending hypocrisy from religion is why you get what you get. No longer getting graded on a curve is not persecution. you are just fragile. Also please, take it easy. im not against you. I think religion has many good things in them, but when christian schools have mass graves in them from the aboriginals they kidnapped they deserve a bit if scrutiny, right? when muslim schools destroy gays, when ethno-religious states conduct genocide? it deserves some scrutiny and shouldn’t be surprised when people talk about it.
So now we’re pivoting to racism, which had zero part of this discussion
You really don’t understand exactly how much of a piece of shit you are, do you?
i think religion has a very large part with racism.
well I don’t think you are a piece of shit and im sorry if I offended you in anyway. I don’t want to turn this into a shit throwing show. you have some good points, and I don’t think religion is all bad . I just dont think its criticized as badly as people think. I know very spiritual people who are great. I also know bad. But if we don’t talk about the bad with the good progress doesn’t happen
And I think your opinions are malformed and bigoted
People like you mistake the impulse for religion as the impulse to abuse. You think the purpose of the church is to protect abusers and that every product of it is tainted by this association
Abusers seek power wherever, the same impulse that drives pedos to enter the clergy is the same impulse that drives hollywood producers and politicians to seek the power to abuse. Per capita, even if you tripled the discovery rate to include clergy not caught, your kid is still safer with a priest than with a politician or a producer but every single time people will insist ‘religion bad because bad things done by religious people’, yet still support hollywood with their dollars and politicians with their support and votes.
But you and people like you conflate the abuse with the religious impulse and it has caused a ridiculous amount of harm including putting innocent people in danger
You are also trying to separate artificially religion and spirituality but that is really only a trick to focus on mainstream religions while giving new age philosophies a free pass. They are the same impulse: a seeking for a thing greater and ultimately unknowable
Look I know why Christianity leaves a bad taste in people’s mouths, all those ‘god hates fags’ sign wavers and the conservative hypocrites that would deport Jesus the moment he came back. And I guarantee you that I find them significantly more disgusting than any of you heathens could muster because they should KNOW better…
History is basically thousands of years of horrors during which people mostly believes their deity approved of all the awful things they did. It isnt the decline of the sacred that opened up this particular can of worms.
If anything its a swing towards authoritianism as a reaction to a whole host of factors.
Changing demographics making white people and men afraid of losing their privileged position
Decline in relegion making the remaining faithful fearful of living in a world where most disagree with them
Apathy on the left due to left wing figures desire not to rock the boat and pwrsue real change
Centralization of media by a handful of people with interests more aligned with the right followed by decades of brainwashing
A characteristic figure to be the focus of the above
Rising inequality to put pressure on the common folks.
Its weird to live in a world where the atheists overwhelmingly voted for normalcy and the devout voted 70% for fascism and still see godless people blamed for what you voted for.
Sorry about not knowing the intricacies of your imaginary friend’s club. BTW, claiming that your imaginary friend is the only one that’s real is pretty arrogant too.
Ok then cite me my post where I claimed God was real.
I FUCKING DARE YOU
You can only win arguments when you fill your opposition’s mouth with lies
First of all, calm down, you don’t want to incur in the deadly sin of wrath and not get invited to the sleepover at your bestie’s.
That’s not how salvation works and even kids in sunday school know that…
Oh no, they mixed up pastor and priest, what a sin! Two words that are super alike and mean basically the same thing, damn them!
Deacons aren’t pastors or priests, they are glorified ushers
They’re still one level down the hierarchy, which was their point
Or are you being an idiot on purpose?
Um… do you imagine that churches are somehow run like the military, and that roles of service are badges of office?
Additionally, there was no ‘down the hierarchy’ point made, they just conflated the two roles, which is why I corrected them
Are you having a problem following this conversation? The ‘Show Context’ button can refresh your memory
Both are ordained ministers, the preist just leads the parish, and the deacon helps the preist lead a parish. Hierarchically they are adjacent. Why are you so confident of my religion?
Basically your side believes in 100 kinds of magic and fairy tales, at least in America the majority of self described Christians believe that the earth is less than 10k years old wished into being by what amounts to a prick of a genie and a non trivial minority of these folks believe the Earth is flat.
After spending their life talking to believers who might as well be actual adult Santa worshippers its easy to be both arrogant and a bit confused by the non imaginary part of the holy heirarchy.
Talking like someone who judges groups solely by the actions of loud extremists and oversimplifies anyhting they don’t understand.
Every theist believes in a detailed fantasy world that would shame the imagination of the average schizophrenic.
The Reddit Atheists have entered the chat and are here to stay it seems
Religion is objectively stupid. We are just expected to pretend you all are reasonable because you are the majority.
Bro thinks I’m a Christian simply because I don’t like Edgelords LARPing Atheism into a Religion.
Let’s go back to where you believe decline in religion has led us to fascism when 70% of Christians voted for a fascist take over of our society and 90% of atheists voted against?
Are you going to pivot to the no true Scotsman fallacy or go somewhere else with it?
I don’t recall ever saying that a decline in religion lead to any of that. Literally all I said was that Reddit Atheism is more “edgy and tryhard” than it is helpful, if you somehow got “Abandoning religion did this.” from that, I don’t know what to say.
I just don’t think it’s fair to say it’s uniquely a Christian problem that lead to fascism taking over America, especially when there are tons of “New Atheists” who are down with Jordan Peterson and other pseudo-intellectuals offering “Trans bad, upvotes to the Left” disguised as “Totally getting it bro”
Are you saying “Edgelords LARPing Atheism into a Religion” implies that somehow? Because what I mean by that is the tendency for so-called “Reddit Atheists” to treat Atheism like a Dogmatic Religion…