idk man I just need to vent i guess
my employer “provides” health insurance in exchange for my time and labor, and for that great privilege they take $600 out of my paycheck every month (covers me, my wife, and our 1yo son)
that’s half our monthly mortgage payment; it’s 2/3 our monthly grocery bill
why?
If you make less than $103,000 / year (family of 3) and pay more than 9.5% of your household gross income on healthcare premiums, you will likely save thousands by using your state’s healthcare marketplace. You are likely eligible because they fixed the family glitch, now the 9.5% applies to the cost for family rather than individual coverage as before.
Although the subsidies will likely end after 2025 if dems don’t retain a majority in house/senate.
It could easily save you thousands of dollars… Like I’m 100% of it… Ask me how I know, lol. Please look into it. I think you have to wait til open enrollment in December? or when your healthcare renews annually. I don’t know the specifics of your situation but I’m pretty sure you and a lot of other people here would save a lot of money. You can also get a low HDHP and get your own HSA to essentially pay no taxes for medical expenditures. I hear fidelity is good, due to no fees.
Speaking of which, is there an active financial advice community on Lemmy (like that old site that should not be named) like /c/financialplanning or something like that?
I realize I’m in /c/antiwork so it goes without saying it’d be nice if we have universal healthcare without all this boloney money being siphoned to these criminal insurance companies. Just trying to help anyone out in a similar situation. ;)
Incredibly helpful information. You don’t need to preface for a shitty situation you did not create or have the power to control. You’ve your part by providing care and empathy in the form of advice that might help some of us.
We got to use what we got for now. Can’t survive on wishes and wants.
Universal healthcare would probably not cost you that much with taxes. But instead a private company gets to reap all the benefits of your money.
And then deny your access to lifesaving health care, don’t forget that part.
Private Company gets all your money and then gets to say “no, you really don’t need that operation, rub some dirt on it and take a salt pill” and then proceed to Scrooge McDuck into a pile of money.
Sometimes your medical team decides you need a procedure, but some guy with a spreadsheet or an AI that is wrong 90% of the time decides you don’t.
The concept that you have coverage for a thing and it gets denied is baffling to me. How are Americans not trading in the streets over the systems your parents built?
Because the system of oppression is so perfect here that nobody dares step out of line. The average American is 1 month away from being homeless. And you can be fired from your job at any time for any reason. Take time off work to protest and an asshole cop decides to arrest you? You get fired from your job, then you get a criminal record making it almost impossible to find a new job. With zero safety net that’s it, you’re on the street for the rest of your life.
The private insurance industry is going to price themselves out of existence eventually. People are going to realize they can save an enormous amount of money by having the government act as payer for their healthcare instead of corporations trying to turn a profit. Healthcare already does not lend itself to distribution via capitalism, you don’t show up to the ED and wave money around to bid on your bed. It should be based on need.
Still waiting for that. Been my hope since I went on this $250-500 a month health insurance journey during my first job in 2005.
As long as people are allowed to go into debt, this industry and others like it will exist forever
It’s likely 1/3rd to 1/2 of what the insurance actually costs.
Insurance numbers in the US are all made up bullshit numbers designed to funnell money from the working class to the rich.
Best thing that ever happened to me was almost dying. Now all of my healthcare, everything, is taken care of.
That’s how fcked the world is.
The fact that insurance is provided through employers in the US is strange. Other products are purchased directly. Presumably there’s some advantage a sort of collective bargaining, but it doesn’t seem to work out that way for this, in part because the employees aren’t really part of the bargaining and in many places employees needs are too diverse to reach am agreement that works well for everyone.
Better solutions aren’t coming any time soon. You can possibly make some better choices though. Although, not participating in the health insurance is borderline line crazy, dental and vision plans don’t make sense for a lot of people. I would pay more for my dental plan than I pay to visit a dentist, including two annual cleanings, periodic x-rays, and infrequent work like cavities - basically the care you need to maintain tooth health. I don’t get the dental plan. You can figure out your own out of pocket costs and see if a dental plan works for you. Going to a dentist that is not in an insurance network is the way to go when doing this. Offices in network are required by the insurance company to charge exorbitant fees to out-of-network customers (the dentists don’t get the same pay from the insurance company though). So say a normal dentist charges $200 for a cleaning. A dentist in a network would be required to charge $400 or something nuts. If a patient is in network, it will say $400 on the EOB, and that the customer is responsible for $50, making it look like the customer saved $350. The insurance company only gives the dentist $150 though, so the dentist gets $200 anyway, the customer really only saved $150. The insurance company gets a bunch of money in annual fees from the employer.
You can see if it makes sense for you. Not everyone will be in the same situation, and maybe it doesn’t eork out. If you have an option for an FSA or something similar, this option is even more attractive, since all those expenses can be paid from untaxed income, whereas the money taken out of your paycheck to cover insurance is after tax I believe.
It’s a weird situation caused by WW2. Due to wage laws, higher wages couldn’t be offered. So they started to offer insurance. It caught on and became the standard.
It’s caused by both major parties being assets to the billionaire class, and working for them, against us.
Good point about dental costs. But insurance is just that, a plan in case you need more than the usual care, so paying a bit more might be worth it.
However, dental insurance specifically I feel is a racket, as it seems the more costly the procedure, the less percentage you get covered. When major dental costs are cheaper to fly to other countries and get them done than to use insurance in the US, something is wrong. I haven’t gotten my issues taken care of for years because I ran into that roadblock where I simply can’t afford to pay “my share”, even though I pay in plenty to the family coverage for everyone else.
FSA is a bit of a racket too. If you have a set plan in place and use the money correctly, it does work. Most people don’t look at it that hard though, and set aside an amount assuming it can be used as needed, later discovering that some things can be used from one part, while others can’t until a part is paid out, much like a deductible. I think it works well for those needing regular medical help, but if you don’t…you lose a chuck of money, with only a bit rolling over for a few months.
In short…health care shouldn’t be this hard and complex. It’s made that way for profit.
As an employer I would LOVE to be shed of this system. I have no reason to be involved in the health care of my employees, and given the state of health care in America there is literally no upside for my business. It’s all bad.
Unfortunately our system requires it, though. If I didn’t offer health care and instead just increased the base salary I wouldn’t be competitive. People would think I was trying to pull a fast-one on them, and few people in America know how to get health care on their own. It’s a mess.
Well the problem is that you are viewing it from a “normal person” vantage… you need to think of your employees as indentured servants, basically slaves you don’t get to actually whip.
Once you get the proper Capitalist vantage point, you realize you can use this “benefit” to squeeze the life out of your employees, specially any of them with Chronic conditions or just a family, as they are hostages to the Health Care you provide!
Our “lords” have already told us why things are the way they are if you look at the “reasoning” behind why the Senate let the child tax credits expire.
“People wouldn’t have an incentive to work.”
They literally use healthcare to chain you to a job. I have 3 coworkers that I know of off hand that have all said they literally are only working here for the health insurance…
This system can go to hell.
“People wouldn’t have an incentive to work.”
That is just their attempt at rationalization. The real reason is much simplier: money, money, money. Lobbyists, Super PACs and the donor class own our politicians. The rich pay for their political campaigns and bribe our politicians in some interesting and creative ways. For example, giving a politician a million directly is illegal, but if he writes a book and then you have the SuperPAC buy a million copies of the politicians book that is somehow legal.
“People wouldn’t have an incentive to work.”
As someone who lives in a place with universal healthcare, I would like to tell these people that many people here still work.
You know, food and shelter are also good incentives.
Hell, luxuries are all that are needed to work. If all my basic needs were taken care of I would still work because I like to travel and drink.
Extra painful that the current system is biased towards large employers. Easier to absorb that overhead if the business is large.
That’s right. For a company greater than 50 employees the insurance companies charge a group rate that is the same for everyone. Fewer than 50 and each employee is billed on their and/or their family’s merits.
Because I have fewer than 50 employees, most of my family employees use their spouse’s insurance from larger company than mine. And there’s little I can do about it.
For my small business I’m just as screwed over as the employee. If I hire a guy I can’t (and don’t want to) ask him him or her health questions, but because I pay half of my employee’s insurance I’m hiring with an unknown cost component. That employee might have a costly pre-existing condition for all I know.
US-specific: The ACA (healthcare.gov) subsidizes healthcare insurance costs based on income. Especially in cases where you income is low this can be an awesome deal. Folks making $35k annually get stellar premium costs, deductibles, and out of pocket maximums. As income increases, the subsidies ramp down.
Unaffordable coverage: If your employer’s plan is considered unaffordable, you might be eligible for premium tax credits through the Marketplace. The affordability test considers the cost of self-only coverage and family coverage. For example, if your share of the premium for your spouse and children is more than 8.39% of your household income in 2024, their coverage might be considered unaffordable.
It is definitely bullshit, but your employer isn’t a winner here either, they’re also paying out $600 a month for your $1200/month health insurance.
The real problem here is why the fuck does health insurance cost as much as housing in this country?
Some companies are self insured and merely pay a health insurance company to administer the plan. They take all the excess and dump it into an investment account where they can profit off of the excess. It’s possible that their employer is coming out ahead.
Line must go up or rich people angry.
ACA institutionalized the health insurance industry as having some broad legally protected powers to fleece the American public. And there is no recourse or alternative besides getting healthcare outside of the country.
Pharma industry is the second parasige that enjoys similar legally protections.
Medical Community sold their asses but especially doctor types… Decent doctors don’t survive anyway, but this is standard for any industry. Worker needs protects if we expect them to do their properly… Ain’t nobody got energy to battle the orphan crushing machine 40 hours per week
Then, we have federal government that’s essentially enabling all of this due to the above clowns capturing regime whores in congress.
This is the standard regime model and most industries are going this way if not already there…
Oil, banking… Tech is trying it too, the 🤡 companies “want to be regulated”
Corpos like having a blank check from the state to fuck the peasants.
It ain’t just US issues, apparently UK parasites are getting that spot quicker than the US nepo babies.
The fuckening will only gets worse.
It was already like that before the ACA.
ACA formalized the corruption. And price increases accelerated too.
Captive Audience. They can’t leave, metaphorically. Everyone should remember ACA was created by a Republican think tank, for exactly that reason. Extortion.
they can go to a foreign country and pay cash, and it will be cheaper with hotel and travel 🤡
but only the “better” people have the cash flow for such “operations” as always… so i would say that vast majority of American slave force in fact: can’t leave, physically.
I’m sure Trump’s concepts of a plan will fix all these problems
Here comes the political brainrot…
You do understand that these discussions can be had with out left right circle jerk?
Why should we not call out the problem when we all want a solution? Conservatives have been the primary henchmen for the ultra-wealthy for generations now.
Neoliberals and Republicans are all conservative shitbags who have ruined our lives for profit. They are all worthy of death, according to some clever French revolutionaries.
Conservatives have been the primary henchmen for the ultra-wealthy for generations now.
Naive
You understand “both sides bad” perpetuates the rot? Of course I was just being sarcastic about the Dotard but if we’re ever going to get universal healthcare passed we need to drive the Wrong Wing out of Congress.
Both sides are bad in fact… You got a lot to learn how the US regime functions my dear.
Vote for either side is vote for the regime.
Vote for anybody else is to deny this regime legitimacy.
Fuck Putin.
No, vote for anyone else is to confirm the GOP’s corruption of democratic principles continues. Take one look at the third-party candidates and even entire “parties” that are actually GOP plants. Destruction of the whole system is their true goal because it makes a fascist takeover easier. Too bad you won’t get anything from them even though you’re helping them.
We have been suffering the two parties taking turns fucking us for decades.
Vote for either party is the vote to support this regime.
Vote for anyone else is letting the system know you are not playing.
“GOP wins” is not a fucking platforms mate… If y’all want people to vote for Democrats, make decmorats do something for the people.
This clowns can’t take proper position omnthe genocide… JFC
Unfortunately, it can’t, because politicians in this country can literally be bribed by individuals and corporations to pass legislation in their favor. Studies have shown over and over again that Universal Healthcare is absolutely cheaper than paying premiums, but it will probably never happen. Because of greed.
Sure. Let granny die in a ditch, just like the good ol’ days.
The biggest kick in the balls is that insurance still doesn’t cover shit. There’s still co-pays, tons of things that aren’t covered, out of network, maximum use of services, and anything large will almost certainly be denied by default. The co-pays alone are often as much as the service should cost.
Health insurance is a parasite. Profiting (massively) by being a gatekeeper to good health is pure evil.
It’s call extortion, and it’s been around since the dawn of time. Some cultures have done something about it, but since The US was founded on selfishness and greed, it will probably never happen here (Universal Care, that is.)
Dr. Glaucomflecken’s Youtube Skit series on US healthcare has really shown me how fucked up it is…
Sure, the Canadian government is stealing my paycheque, yadda yadda yadda. Still my health, dental, life supplemental insurance plan costs $800/year and most routine stuff like checkup exams, basic drugs, basic procedures, and is free or is in the tens of dollars that I need to pay.
I haven’t been to a dentist in 8 years. I’ve only recently been in a hospital because my back gave out and I was stuck on the floor. Dont let anyone take away that healthcare, dont become like us. This is misery for no reason. My fucken teeth ache.
I cracked off a piece of my teeth but it doesn’t like cause immediate pain and my last visit cost me several hundred dollars even with my “dental plan” that my employer didn’t provide me a policy number for. And I still need to save up for my wisdom teeth to be pulled cause they are rotting in my head and cause my jaw to lock up.
Yeah the world doesn’t realize how fucked the US is for health of its citizens.
Sorry to hear that bud. It’s the reason I have dentures. It’s literally cheaper to have all, or most, of your teeth pulled and buy dentures than it is to have 2 or more root canals and crowns. It’s outrageous, and obscene.
To be fair, health insurance is equally expensive in Europe. We just discount it a lot for low income families and above average pays a lot more to substitute that missing money.
Then that doesn’t sound “equally expensive” if it’s discounted for everyone that needs it discounted.
Not when the option in the US is “then don’t have healthcare”
health insurance is equally expensive in Europe.
Source?
Or more. A lot more.
I pay $700/mon for a family for health only, not including prescriptions, dental, or vision
Employer contribution is $1600/mon
That’s insane
I’m surprised large companies haven’t pushed back on it.
I didn’t know much about that side of the insurance pyramid, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen anything about the companys part fighting it in the news.
It usually looks like cutting plans, and the adoption of high deductible plans
Or more.
Just doing mine now (open enrollment time). No changes to what I had this year, but had a 20% price increase to just under $600.
My employer is paying $3200 for my coverage (family plan, to be clear). Companies should be in wide support of universal healthcare.
Housing costs more than $2000 a month now 😭
More like why do both cost so much? Housing is dramatically cheaper in the good countries.
Capitalism. 40% of Apple’s total revenue goes to shareholders just for existing. Latestagecapitalism is like having a severe tape worm infection. The rich take most of the wealth we create without doing any of the work
The way capitalist free markets are supposed to self-regulate is by customers refusing to buy goods and services which are too expensive. But when the alternative to buying those goods and services is dying in the street, understandably people will can’t reasonably refuse.
I would opt out of your employer health insurance, and go fully private with a policy in your own name. There’s no way in hell that that premium is real.
You are getting down voted because you said the dirty private word, but you are entirely right.
Id say the bigger problem might be your employer Heath insurance company can tell you no to opting out.
This is madness. Where I’m from, we have a nationalised healthcare system and yet my employer offers private healthcare coverage for no additional cost to myself (free)!
yeah that sounds like an employer actually providing a benefit in exchange for you working for them
You’re dumb as a rock. And so is the yurobro.
In those European countries the employee often costs 20-30% more than their stated salary.
There’s absolutely no such thing as “my employer gives me extra insurance free of charge”. It’s not free. They’re paying for it.
As I worked for a small startup I know all the numbers. I received X gross on paper, the company had expenses of 1.2X, and I got 0.6X on my bank account. Oh boy, gotta love those “free” health insurances, unemployment benefits, paid sick days etc.
That’s wonderful. Where is this, if it’s not too personal, if it is, no worries.
The United Kingdom (and hilariously, it’s an American company that employs me and gives me private healthcare).
😂. I’m happy for you. Eat. Them.
Private health care is very different in the UK. If you’re ever in serious ill health, or need anything remotely risky private healthcare will tell you to go to the NHS. It’s mostly GPs with nicer offices and NHS consultants moonlighting.
It’s bullshit, but your employer may be covering your insurance almost completely and that 600 goes toward your family. At least that’s how my insurance works. Again still bullshit that health care costs that much and then they won’t cover shit when you need it.
that’s an interesting (and stupid) possibility that I hadn’t considered
“You should be grateful, peasant. That’s a good looking kid you got there. It would be a shame if she got sick. What were you saying, again, I just got a notice about a stock price increase.”
My options at my last 3 jobs have all been more than 1400/month.
Do you think your taxes would go up $17k per year if America got universal healthcare? I’m going to say probably not.
I’d gretly prefer universal healthcare.
Insurance is extra expensive when you have a family in the US. I’m single and my monthly cost is less than $100 a month. Having a family is more expensive for everything.
But WHy dON’t YoUNg poPLE wANT tO sTarT a FaMILy?!?!
