Dead internet here we come!
Makes me miss the wild west days of the internet. Everything felt more… human. Now it feels like a soulless corporate husk. It’s wild that covid babies won’t know what those days were like.
Nostalgia fallacy
A two word rebuttal naming the argument type someone is using, does not constitute a valid argument.
Yes it does.
Three does
Check out https://wiby.me/
The Internet gained steam through hobbyists and is now that corporate shell as described. In my opinion it absolutely was a better place 25 years ago. Today the internet is filled with social engineering everyone’s trying to influence something and it’s terrible.
The Internet started as this kinda long-haired hippy fella who thought it would be great if everyone could share knowledge and have conversations with everyone else regardless of where they are geographically. Then the corpos made him cut his hair, put on a suit and tie and get a damn job! And 25 years later, he’s a yuppie corpo slave. I want my hippy back!
People are certainly susceptible to Rosy Retrospection, but let’s not forget that 2023’s word of the year was enshittification for a reason!
You’re right in that it will never be like it was, but there are still fringes and niche communities that have that human feel. The thing is they’re much less engaging without algorithms and UX driving engagement, we’re not drawn to them in the same way.
For me, it was AIM chatrooms and ebaums forums, maybe the super early days of Skype (before being sold to Microsoft obviously). Shit did feel more real, and while content maybe didn’t come out at the same frequency, and there sure was shit, you just knew you were talking about it with other people. Made some good friends back then, would’ve been cool to stay in touch, but 20+ years is a long time.
Agreed, but Lemmy feels like the old Internet for the most part. I suspect that 90% ish of comments here are actual humans. The remaining 10% is pushing some kind of agenda.
Definitely more than 10%. The only really unbiased info I’m finding here is related to obscure coding stuff, or Linux tips.
Reddit has a lot of shills, but that’s their business model and they guard access cuz they want to get paid. Lemmy has no moat, and no filter outside of individual mods
I agree. There’s also a pervasive feeling that lemmy is unaffected by manipulation and misinformation.
If Lemmy continues to grow sooner or later it will become a large enough target for manipulation, and I wonder how federation will fare at that time.
Idk, hexbear content comes up in my feed and I feel that’s all manipulation and misinformation
Yeah, I feel the same, but I don’t really know enough about it to make that assertion.
Alright. I been afraid to ask for fear of getting banned from other communities hosted on their instance, but what is the deal with hexbear? The chat community seems like satire, but it gives off the same kind of vibes as the_donald, just far-left instead of far right. Like, I consider myself a lefty, but their community just seems self-destructive and toxic. Maybe that’s the point, though? Honestly unsure, and afraid to ask on their instance cuz I don’t wanna get accused of “just asking questions” and banned.
It’s a bunch lonely people who got hypnotized by a podcast and now that podcast informs all their opinions.
It really does feel like the_donald doesn’t it? I have no idea what they’re about. They claim to far left but when you look at what they’re actually saying it’s all hate for any position on the left. Even the word “left” is a dirty word there. They’re probably trolls trying to muddy the water. Maybe it’s some astroturfing or a space to experiment and generate new misinformation content. Idk, it sucks though, it feels all so toxic.
That’s why I’m glad, that my instance defederated from those. I saw some of that content from another instance and I don’t miss it.
Yep, Reddit continues to shit itself.
And 80% of Reddit is filled with degenerates of every kind. It’s a total cesspool of excrement.
Crusty jugglers
Uh, this post is a bummer and I don’t even know if I actually believe the premise… Whatever I guess, lett’s all actually just get out of here and go get some Sprite® brand family products, you guys.
But 7up™ is made with natural ingredients, less sugar and is more limey!
My family prefers Brawndo. It has what plants crave.
I’ve said this before, but we also need to be cautious about this on lemmy and devise ways to empower mods and the community to fight back against this, I’m not entirely sure how since it’s a very complex problem
I agree, this is a very complex issue. As a community we should come together and brainstorm ideas while quenching our thirst with a nice can of Diet Pepsi, the zero-sugar alternative to being thirsty!
I am convinced this is already happening. One example is the endless new accounts posting ibtimes links.
There are also propoganda websites posted regularly by new accounts (especially sowing disinformation about Russia’s war on Ukraine).
Basically be wary of anything posted where it’s their first post. Often they make accounts and don’t use them for months so they look older.
I also think astroturfing is happening but at lower rate than reddit.
Like you, I have no idea how we can counter this at scale.
The same critical thinking should apply as all other platforms.
A link posted to an article on a company’s public blog published in the last 24hrs? Almost certainly viral marketing.
It might help if a poster’s number of posts and signup date were listed at the top of each post or comment. Would’t be a fix but might help weed out upsprouting autotrolls.
Yes, definitely. Perhaps highlighted if it’s one of their first few posts or the account is new.
There are a lot of subreddits which routinely award hundreds or thousands of upvotes for repetitive low value posts. … This is a cog in the well-tuned machine of new-accounts being created and matured to look ‘real’ for when they are later used for advertising / manipulation later down the line.
In the early months of a new account, it is easier to spot. Eg. If you see a post on a game subreddit with a title like “Exciting to try this game, any tips get started?”, you might click the profile and see that their entire history is a bunch of low-effort discussion starters. “Name a band from the 80s that everyone has forgotten”; “What’s the most misunderstood concept in maths?”; “What’s the most underrated (movie / band / drug / car / tourist attraction / whatever suits the topic of the subreddit)?”
A heap of threads like that, on a new account with a very generic name (adjective-noun-numbers is a common pattern); posting on a variety of subredits… is highly suspicious. But it gets harder to recognise as the account gets older and has a longer history - at which point it is ready to be sold / used for its next purpose.
Most, if not all game reddits, product reddits, and company reddits are secretly or openly controlled by their respective corpos. Keeping communities as third party forums is a must have IMO.
It’s bloody difficult.
I used to mod on /r/videos years and years back. We had this one guy who was not very active as a mod in the day to day stuff, but was respected because he’d basically disappear for a few months and then reappear with a huge post in our modding sub basically going “so these are all spammers/malicious actors, here’s their profiles, the accounts were created in these waves, here’s where they’ve copied existing posts / the identical generic comments and things they use to get around our posting requirements, the targets they’ve been promoting, etc”. Just huge pages of thoroughly researched proof.
This was well before we had huge awareness of situations like Russia manipulating social media - it was usually those viral video places that buy up rights to videos and handle licensing and promotion. It’s why for a long time any licensed videos from places like viralhog etc were outright banned - they were constantly trying to manipulate reddit postings in bad faith, and even trying to socially engineer the mod team in modmail, so any videos that mentioned a licensing deal in the description were automatically banned from posting.
If we didn’t have that one guy spotting the patterns, most of it would have gotten by easily. Unfortunately he did eventually disappear for good. No clue what happened to him, hope he just cut out social media or something. But with the spamming and astroturfing stuff… Even after fighting it for years I can’t tell you what to do to counter it besides “have more of that guy”.
The director of marketing at my company just got out of a meeting with reddit and is super hyped at funneling all our Facebook and Twitter dollars into reddit instead. I didn’t have the heart to tell him he’s five years too late.
Is fb or twitter really any more useful for ads though?
You can tell by the amount of reddit posts or comments that links you a paywalled article. Like what the fuck?! Is everyone paying for this shit?
Actually that is not true your interactions are very authentic. Beep boop.
YOUR ACCENT IS STRANGE, FELLOW HUMAN124 Shell Lane, Fontana Georgia Michael Handly 000-01-0000 Thank. You for .the. gracious. Offer. ! I.will.provide.my.banking.info.in.future....```
Seen this post over and over. This is not a new study at that point
New study: 15% of Lemmy posts are studies about 15% of all Reddit content
:D
If it’s not corporations then it’s PACs astroturfing. It’s nothing new.
Companies definitely astroturf on Reddit, but, they do it through third or even fourth parties. There is a whole micro industry of vote buying and comment spamming, ad firms or companies will pay such groups to add certain messaging to their comment spam. You can actually make a quick buck by selling any old Reddit accounts to such groups.
And they get pretty obvious in big subs like /cars and /gaming. So many posting opinions like car magazines or gaming reviews do - point out nit-picky negatives that are relatively inconsequential to the product, softball other criticism, but give an overall decent review. Heaven help you if you actually voice an opinion critical of the object, because you’re allowed to have that opinion as an individual, that doesn’t toe the line and you get instant downvotes.
those are some low numbers. between corporate, state, and anonymous shills and trolls, I wholly believe at least 50% of all reddit content is paid for or manipulative for agenda based groups. the sheer number of repetitve posts with repetitve comments constantly being on the front page is pure propaganda. Of course I rmemebr back in the old days when the reddit feed was in (almost) real time where you couldliterally wait every 10 minutes and refresh for an almost completely new front page. Now it’s all about repetivie agendas and narratives operating in cycles to manipulate public opinions. the same lame post will sit on the front page for entire days.
I’d say there is a huge amount of bots, then the smart bots, then the actual shills. The smarter ones run complex operations and are able to use their own power to self propel their own stories. And there are a lot of similar ‘power users’ who are not wholly paid for by someone but would do work for the highest bidder. I’d bet that yes, 50% of what’s on the front page of major things is reputation management or Hail Corporate stuff, then I’d wager the mostly less popular stuff is actual people, with a ton of bad posts from all sides at the low popularity
One thing I’ve noticed over the years is that in terms of marketing, reddit has a disproportionately high level of return in interaction relative to its size, while Twitter has traditionally had a low level of return relative to its size.
For some reason, comments on reddit has always been viewed as more trustworthy relative to other social media platform, despite reddit or’s general reputation for being confidently incorrect on many subjects.
There are certain people whose entire career was made by their reddit posts, yet, it was always odd to me that reddit never managed to effectively capitalize on this other than making their platform worse with every update.
Testing out this theory has been interesting.
Reddit’s strategy is genuinely brain dead. Just think of the shit they’ve been up to:
- Jacking up API prices to unreasonable levels and killing off third party apps that brought millions of users on to your platform
- Continuously make the UI shittier and shittier to the point where it’s unusable
- Do the same with the app
- Kill off old Reddit which is the sole reason millions of users still use the site
- Add awards and expand the feature to basically become paid reaction emojis
- Remove awards even though they were one of the biggest revenue streams
- Announce it was a mistake and add the awards again
- Add avatars that nobody asked for and make some of them paid
- Add a premium subscription that does nothing and do absolutely nothing to improve it
- Add a bunch of useless features that nobody uses like Reddit live
Truly the works of geniuses.
Old Reddit still works.
For now, but they’ve been chipping away at it slowly but surely.
I worked at startups and I’m not going to deny that I was absolutely horking my company as a solution for years on Reddit. Especially with niche products.
This was from 2014-2018, and then I left startups and worked in corps.
When Google has plans to slurp reddit comments, I bet I could gamify reddit even more.
And now imagine that companies paid reddit money to be enabled to trin their AI on them…
