There are no healthy people. Just undiagnosed
If so, then that implies each and every individual is just unique and neurodivergency is not an issue.
In all seriousness. To me, theres one crucial difference between neurodivergence and autism. Autistic people (and I’m talking here about extreme autism) are unable to learn behavioral patterns of other humans around them. This is an objective disability that prevents them from functioning in the society.
If you’re able to learn from behaviors of other people, reason about them and act accordingly, then there’s no disability to speak of.
Then, we agree.
Proceed to talk for 3 hours about the train unloading and smelter setups I made in Factorio.
Ask me about my world-spanning train network in Satisfactory!
Oooh did you use the bulk loader and express smelter mods?
I’m listening.
So… You guys want to talk about fire alarm systems?
Yes. But more importantly, would you like to talk about British cars of the 1960s - 1980s?
Actually, I would like that. As soon as I learned about common home fire alarms using radioisotopes to create a gap in an electric circuit that can be closed by ionized smoke particles, I was fascinated. I know there are some fancy ones that use optics instead so the can detect particles of any kind. The heat sensitive ones seem cool for cooking areas so there are fewer false alarms. I imagine by now there are ones thats use FLIR/thermal cameras.
All that is just detection. Even the communication is really cool. The loud beeping sound is simple but effective. I like the ones that release a spicy mist to wake deaf people. Flashing lights go without saying. Then there’s networked alarms. Do they go straight to the Fire Department or are they like security systems that get filtered by a third party first?
The auto-response features (if that’s what they’re called) like fire sprinklers are interesting also. I read that they typically release dirty water because it’s been sitting in the pipes for so long. Sure, dirty water is hardly an issue during a fire. It could be raw sewage and still be better than nothing. Still, I wonder why they’re not on a loop integrated with the rest of the fresh water system. The advanced response systems like halon are kinda scary. Probably not something I’ll see in my lifetime. I’m sure it’s better than the alternative, though. The foam for airplane hangers is pretty neat. Wouldn’t want to be in there, though.
I wonder what the cutting edge stuff is now.
I’ve worked on inert gas systems before, they’re pretty scary, because if you screw up, it can be tens of thousands of dollars of gas dumped.
Sprinkler systems typically use steel pipe, which isn’t safe for drinking water, which is why the water smells like rusty ass.
we’re waiting!
HOLY COW THERE’S DEEP LORE REGARDING FIRE ALARM SYSTEMS?! O.O
Do you have a favorite fact? Or like, one particular thing about the subject that really surprised you? Do you have a fire alarm system in mind as “the best” or “worst” in terms of performance and detection? :D
HOLY COW THERE’S DEEP LORE REGARDING FIRE ALARM SYSTEMS?! O.O
There’s deep lore about pretty much anything, if you’re willing to dig for it.
As someone who works with fire alarm systems, it amazes me that there are people who learn about them voluntarily.
Ugh now that my husband works in fire alarm systems, he has become someone who thinks I would want to learn about them voluntarily. Every flipping building we enter, “ooh, not to be annoying, but look at this! They have xyz!”
Have you ever noticed the smoke detectors in line at Disney? Because I’ve been forced to. And they must have gotten special permits or something because they’re outside of regular code rules. God bless him.
I would also ooke to know these things!
/subscribe fire_alarm_system_fun_facts
Let me talk to you about why we need more trains
I wanna hear about maglev trains in evacuated tunnels. I know it’s a fantasy because of the costs, but I like to imagine it could be real.
Maglev in general is cool, too. At least they’re real. They’re still heavily limited by costs, though.
I’ll absolutely listen to anything about high-speed rail in general.
That failing, I’m good with standard-gauge , passenger rail, too.
Wasn’t that Musks failed hyperloop thing?
I do have to admit the idea is pretty cool though. Not sure how they could be used practically for anything that would justify the cost though. Like cargo transit? At least then you can cut more safety requirements compared to human passengers. But then you have the question of why go to that effort to move cargo faster than a train anyway
Yeah, although as with most things Musky, the concept was already musty by that point. His particular talent seems to be getting other people to spend their own time and money on his pet projects.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vactrain
I think you hit the nail on the head, and I would guess that cheap, ubiquitous access to high-bandwith telecom, and improved air transit probably displaced a lot of the potential demand for long-disrance, passenger rail transport. Standard rail is already cheap for cargo.
I don’t think we’ll see a serious revisitation of the concept until population density and environmental damage make air travel less appealing and economical.
Having said that, and despite it’s many problems, maglev vactrains come with a bunch of cool stuff and could be potentially cheaper per mile traveled than current rail (obviously the upfront, per-mile cost of track is orders of magnitude higher).
-
NYC to LA in about an hour (if they’re still above sea level by that point).
-
Underground, so cooling is cheaper, and it leaves more space on the surface, fewer traffic crossings, etc.
-
Electric power, which will probably be even cheaper by that time, if it ever comes.
-
Massive utility conduits. You already built a big-ass tunnel spanning a continent. Why not add water, power, and data conduits for a relatively small additional cost?
-
Very few moving parts. Potentially less maintenance that standard rail, albeit more than surface maglev. This also makes it more amenable to automation, allowing for individual cars/carriages to travel. This means being able to offer several trips per hour rather than per day with a similar or even better occupancy.
Anyway, that’s just my fantasy, but at this point, I might as well wish for a flying unicorn.
The vast majority of a long distance railway goes through land with fuck all value. Some cows might be annoyed by the rails taking space from their field but that is about it. It’s only the end part in a city where you may want to save space by putting it underground.
-
Do you know how many different types of trains there are?
No, but one friend of mine absolutely does.
(And, yes, she’s autistic.)
AI least six, I’m positive of that.
Six… or Seven?
This 6-7 joke proudly presented to you by Autism.
Okay so we have steam train, petrol/gasoline train, electric train, … Wind train ? Manually driven train, …
Wagon train, maglev, monorail, various gages, did you know one of the bigger logistical problems faced by the Confederacy in the American Civil War was that their train infrastructure was primarily from centers of production to the coast, without many connections in between?..
You forgot funiculars, the cable operated train, and the ones above can be broken down more…
I fell for the trap, didn’t I?
Are sled dogs a new type, or do they fall under manual?
And to the horror of software developers: Agile release trains. Which are neither agile, not real trains. Nor fun to be in.
Oh, the death march?
At least twelve
Hey, I did not say that I knew, just asked if you did!?! 😂🤪
Oh okay in that case no
Define ‘type’.
And to his horror, Luke proceeded to name every train ever made.
By SERIAL NUMBER AND PATENT!
Sorted by the number and weight of the bolts used on assembly.
This with depression
Don’t be depressed commit war crimes against the government instead
“Everyone’s a little bit autistic”
“You’re too normal to be autistic”
Yeah. Not everyone is autistic; there are lots of other neurospicy reasons why people are the way they are.
Litterly my coworkers used that first one… It annoys me so much. “We are all not normal here”
“Yes Janine. We all pee everyday. But can you understand the difference between peeing everyday and peeing so often each day that it disrupts other parts of your daily life?”
I swear I’m gonna use this next time I hear “everyone is a bit autistic”.
What if it disrupts other people’s lives more than my own?
If your peeing disrupts other people’s lives there’s a chance you’ll be arrested at some point. Unless you’re a politician or rich of course.
This makes me lol because I work in an industry where people are extremely “not normal”.
There are a handful of people who I would believe fit into the neurotypical category. But it’s largely blue collar trades people who are at the top of their field so people are pretty accepting of quirks. It would be fascinating to study how under diagnosis of men in the trades compares to under diagnosis of “shy” women and girls.
Some example:
- people who would say they don’t do math or stats but who have hockey draft spreadsheets that they fill out while watching live draft coverage.
- the people who I encounter in tunnels way after hours who are, like me, just trying to answer a question that’s been bugging them and can’t stop until they figure it out.
- the person who told me he was going to go home and build a model of the mixing system I described (was describing an existing system that is being operated incorrectly and how it should look) so that he could better understand it
- all the people who have the flat affect come out when they are dumping data (this warms my heart lol)
I’m on the fence about disclosing at work because if I get a response like that I will lose my mind and don’t trust myself not to blurt out “half of y’all are autistic but aren’t ready to hear that”.
(That would be incredibly inappropriate for so many reasons)
My life summarised in two panels.
In my day, I was (self diagnosed as) Asperger’s (obsesses on somewhat socially acceptable things like math and physics, gets good grades, very awkward), and seeing as there was zero effective treatment available, a formal diagnosis was counter productive. I did like speed a lot in my twenties though. I eventually worked out good coping mechanisms and aside from an absurdly low social battery, I do well in my way.
Which I bring up to raise the point that perhaps this ‘spectrum’ thing is pretty counter productive for the profoundly disabled on the far end. Seems like people on my end (functional but could use help) are sucking the oxygen out of room to their detriment now that there are useful treatments for us. Is there some sort push to separating the two again ?
Genuinely want to know, I feel some guilt for downgrading their suffering (even though I think, intellectually, it’s a way of cheaping out on their care that I have no control over).
Given how they are a cluster of conditions where most people have some subset of noticable conditions, I’m not sure there is a clear way to differentiate them.
Also, the last person I saw who brought up this argument about how functional they are and how it was unfair to people who are less functional was in the same comment also simultaneously talking about how they’re depressed or suicidal from extreme loneliness and strongly wished to be cured of their autism. That hardly seemed functional to me if you are struggling so much with life even if you can pretend to be functional enough to hold some jobs. I think many people have a strong tendency to downplay their own suffering. You can see the same behavior from people who’ve been victims of abuse who frequently will deny they’ve ever been abused, but if you ask them to describe what happened, they’ll describe abuse and then just try to say it really wasn’t that bad or that such is normal.
Also, we already have terminology to refer to lots of those traits commonly associated with autism. Nonverbal, hypersensitive, speech-processing disorder, and more. If there’s a reason to communicate those things, you can do so with or without mentioning autism.
Also, the last person I saw who brought up this argument about how functional they are and how it was unfair to people who are less functional was in the same comment also simultaneously talking about how they’re depressed or suicidal from extreme loneliness and strongly wished to be cured of their autism.
Yeah, not me. Quite happy with who I am, wouldn’t change it. I get a pretty useful, different, point of view which I wouldn’t give up, but I’ve had time to acclimate.
I also doubt how useful language tricks like ‘terminology to refer to lots of those traits commonly associated with autism. Nonverbal, hypersensitive, speech-processing disorder, and more’ are to deal with those problems.
Still, I agree it’s a cluster and a hard problem to differentiate (except for profound things like nonverbal).
I believe that there should be way more than 2 conditions which are currently just called autism. You seem to have one, my son is non-verbal and physically unable to complete basic tasks like eating a bowl of cereal, others feel uncomfortable if someone touches their face, others need to constantly fidgit, some require music to feel comfortable, some are obsessed over a certain topic like boats or trains or Lego or whatever. All are currently “autism” but don’t seem to be related. I wish they got rid of the "spectrum"and studied the separate types as separate conditions.
My sympathy and respect for your situation, and your son’s.
Right?, it’s not at all the same thing. Non-verbal and academically good with bad socialization are totally different in needs. There is a line through both conditions, and it could be useful in helping both, but making it seem like it’s just a smeared out spectrum from bad to good does no-one any favors.
Agreed. I feel like if we separate them doctors and scientists could study causes and care more effectively. What you need is totally different from my son, why are they combined? Yes the common cold, the flu and TB all result in coughing but don’t have the same treatment. They seem more related then “autism”.
The difficulty of diagnosing autism shows this. If you get strep throat, take a test and it’s either positive or negative. No one can say “yeah, it says I don’t have strep throat but…”
I think this misunderstands illnesses in general and is low-key dismissive of mental health issues.
One of your sons care is different for the same reason ones might be different if they both had flu but were suffering different severities of it. One might just need some bed rest, while the other could end up in hospital on a ventilator if their case is more severe. That ventilator won’t particularly help the one that needs bed rest, but is necessary for the other.
The difficulty in diagnosing is pretty inherent to mental health in general - where’s the cut off for depression, when one person is just numb to the world and another is constantly breaking down and trying to kill themselves? What about anxiety, where one person could freeze up a bit in social situations while another starts panicking as soon as they step outside? They’re still interfering with your life, just to different degrees.
My neice is non-verbal. I’m on “the spectrum”. It’s not the same. Plenty of overlaps, but it’s not the same. I appreciate awareness for the topic at all, but also hope it doesn’t detract from treating the most serious symptoms
Exactly. They are different and should not be “autism”. Technically my kid is not non-verbal but limited to one or two words, like if he wants to watch blue’s clues he’ll just say blue or if he’s hungry he will just say yum yum.
I’m not a doctor but you and your niece have different conditions and likely have different causes and potentially different treatments. We should eliminate the word autism and separate it into like 5 or 10 different conditions and study them separately.
If helping someone with mild symptoms took away from those with more severe symptoms, I’d see a point. But I haven’t come across any evidence of that.
It’s important to remember that there is more going on than what we see. I can get by well enough for most daily living tasks, but when I’m at my limit I’m treated like I should be able to handle it like a neurotypical. I hate having to explain to my managers at work what it’s like to shut down from overstimulation. I hate having to be seen as “unreceptive” to changes just because it takes time and understanding for me to adjust to new routines.
I’m trying my best, but to separate “mild” autism from “severe” autism diminishes the struggles that many of us go through, especially for those of us who didn’t receive diagnosis or treatment as children. I’ve had to learn how to navigate this bizarre world on my own, but just because I can “pass” sometimes doesn’t mean I’ve mastered it.
I see this sentiment even in my own coworkers, which is sad because we all work with autistic children. I have a learner who’s exceptionally bright. He asks questions that could only be properly answered by a college professor. Sometimes when discussing him, my coworkers will ask, “Why is he even here?” I have to explain that just because someone’s intelligent in some ways, that doesn’t mean they’re caught up with social and emotional intelligence. The kid has difficulty regulating himself, while he’s made massive progress in social skills while at our school - I’ve seen him grow from a kid who only wants to play alone and who would get annoyed when others tried to play with him, to one that happily joins in on games with others and even tolerates when another kid has a drastically different play style.
He’ll be getting ready to graduate and go off to public school soon, which will be bittersweet for me. I was a lot like him as a kid, and I can already imagine some of the difficulties he’ll face - many of which will come from adults who see his intelligence and assume he can do more than he’s capable of. So when I work with him, I make it a point to tell him that not everyone will understand what he’s going through, while teaching him functional communication to get his needs met regardless. I’m sure this little bird will fly high some day, we don’t have to teach him how to soar. But before he can get there, he has to learn how to land himself safely - that’s where I (and the rest of his teachers) come in.
Nice perspective, that actually helps me with my moral conundrum FWIW, thanks. Still wonder if we’re not short changing the truly profoundly affected, but it’s great to see the progress you and the structures around you have made in helping those like me (us?).
It brings to mind something I wish I had access to earlier, the TV show ‘Lie To Me’ which presents the possibility of using learning (perhaps targeted hyper fixation) to compensate for lack of instinctive social understanding. The show itself mostly dealt in extremes for dramatic effect, but it lead me to useful materials and techniques that have been useful, if somewhat exhausting, in life. Don’t know if it’s likely to be helpful in general, but it might be useful for certain cases (like me).
My mom says I cannot be autistic because I’m “ in shape and pretty “ and also I “ liked being hugged as a kid “ … yeah so why do I have fucking meltdowns when I try to eat in public and all the noise makes me nauseous and nervous? Just one tiny example that she witnesses and asks me “ what’s wrong with you ? “
I had a similar conversation with a date a few weeks ago. I told her that I am getting tested for autism in a few weeks.
“You don’t seem autistic.”
Then spent the next 15 minutes talking about Magic: The Gathering cards. She was very to forgiving and said, “Oh. I get it now.”
I’d be so happy if a psych would spend 15 minutes talking to me about ISO8601 timestamps or IPv6.
I spent my entire last therapy session talking about the history the rise of the IBM PC clone market and how Microsoft’s contract with IBM made it possible lol
This is a good way to filter out bad people from your life.
I’ll argue the flip side. I have a son who is 13 and firmly L2/L3. This is where a lot of autistic people sit and specifically online they are grossly under-represented because they don’t have the capacity to socialize even from a computer or phone.
My older son is what used to be Asperger’s which I would define as your L1.
I continue to hate the fact that they flattened their taxonomy with DSM V. Asperger’s != Autism.
So I get and chuckle at the memes but when people think of autism they are thinking of my autistic son not the Asperger’s one.
The representation of autistic people in the media, and in social media like this, is not an accurate representation of autistic people
Yah I hate that people call SUVs, “cars”. They’re completely different.
And it’s terrible that people started calling lecterns, “podiums”. They’re entirely independent of one another.
And it sucks that people call 1/2 baths, “bathrooms” even though nobody’s doing any kind of bathing in those things.
The problem I have is that there is a loss of specificity, not that Asperger’s and autism are fundamentally different. Autism used to be defined as the cluster of autism-like symptoms paired with a developmental problem with language. Asperger’s was very similar, except that the impairment was with social interaction and non-verbal communication rather than linguistic aspects. Nowadays, while there is a lot of overlap, the difference is more like car vs truck rather than car vs SUV. You can classify a truck as a type of car, but you can’t classify a car as a type of truck.
That series of analogies is absolute garbage and you know it.
What analogies?
Those are examples of other conflationary ambiguing terms that are annoying.Of course I just made up conflationary and ambiguing. I don’t know if they’re the proper terms.
It does kinda fit. The main part that changes between the “levels” of a diagnosis is the severity of symptoms and how much they impact your ability to take part in society. If car and SUV are too close for you, then we can also compare a normal car with a three wheeled one. Its kinda different but still the same. Everyone but the most pedantic person would categories it as a car.
It doesn’t mean everyone needs the same accommodation, but that’s also the case for someone with a broken pinky vs a broken neck.
Here we have the diagnostic definition at odds with the desire to socialize the specific condition to the layman and advance acceptance.
I agree the new descriptors sometimes runs counter to that effort. So I tend to describe my L1ASD condition as “the Asperger’s style of autism” to the uninitiated.
Unfortunately, this can also draw negativity from the cohort of autistic folks that want to see the term Asperger’s deleted because they misunderstand who Hans Asperger was and what he actually was about. The popular story about that has been distilled to a soundbyte of “He WaS a NaZi” spongebob font and all.
It’s frustrating and anecdotally I’m 10+ years in my journey parenting autistic children and the consensus with the professionals is that the new descriptors are a continued challenge. Will it change with time? Who knows? All I can do is advocate for those who get left out and/or left on the wrong side of these memes because like my younger son they cannot advocate for themselves.
It will change when all the regular folks learn to use their sense of reason to question their own emotionally-driven judgements.
I don’t see that being a skill that is encouraged in many parts of our society, because it would make the people more capable of thinking critically and less susceptible to the political/ideological manipulations that prey on their anger and fear.
It is my firm belief the only way things will change is if neurotypical people are forced to have relationships with autistic peers. Right now we do not do this. Autistic programs by and large are professionals helping autistic kids while working with other autistic kids.
There needs to be programs in schools that force children to become peer buddy groups with autistic kids.
Maybe… but I feel like forcing people to do things doesn’t often yield the best results. I do agree that consistent and positive interaction would be meaningful.
Culturally, we need people to set the examples and to lead correctly. And that’s adults, whether its teachers or parents, including and accepting the autistic kid and encouraging the neurotypical kids to be the same.
If that’s in line with what you’re saying, then we’re on the same page.
If that’s in line with what you’re saying, then we’re on the same page.
Yes.
If it makes sense it’s the whole, “I have a child with autism not an autistic child.”
I think I understand, despite not personally being one to take a position over how to express that concept. It seems like it might be more meaningfully applied by yourself as you can clearly relate the distinction along the severity gradient of autism.
PRO-TIP: When you learn that a person is a bigoted moron, just stop acknowledging their existence!
Unless you want to help fiight bigotry.
In my experience that is mostly pointless. Those people are not interested in facts they just want to be right.
You don’t fight emotional positions with facts. That’s correct.
These boots were made for walking and shit stomping.
Well thanks Karen, you’re almost certainly more knowledgeable than three different medical professionals.
Both my kids are now diagnosed with autism, both my wife and I had an aha moment about our own lives and personalities. We’re a fully neuro divergent family. My mom says I can’t be because I love to learn things and read…
Not exactly the same, but I had a psychiatrist who said that because I was able to laugh I couldn’t have depression. Like??
Same. My therapist told me “you don’t look depressed”.
I’ve been told I don’t look autistic. You should see them collapsing when I ask them what autism looks like
Hi, lifelong major depression endurer here. You can absolutely laugh when you’re depressed. In fact if you laugh just the right way, it can lead to increased medication and more frequent therapy sessions, maybe even a visit to a nice medical facility. Never had that last one myself, but I know someone who was legally disallowed from purchasing a firearm for years (IL).
This also happens when you say that you’re autistic to other autistic people, but more wokely
