The part where they don’t need or want Identity information is because they already know who you are from sign up.
The only thing I miss from reddit is my favorite small niche subs.
Invisible bicycles.
Where people take photos of people on bicycles and Photoshop out the bicycle. You can request or do the edits.
Forbiddensnacks
Photos of stuff that looks like delicious food but is not food.
There was another with short videos of animals in sync. Like chickens or dogs .
Oh and another that was photos of cats, sitting on clear glass. The photos were from the underside.
There was another photoshop battle one. Where there was a prompt and then everyone would submit a photoshopped mash of the prompt.
But I bet AI has ruined that one.
I think I miss forbidden snacks the most.
Same style of stuff I miss. Mainly instrument related subreddits, books, and boutique blu-rays. However I don’t miss Reddit itself at all. Especially with how right wing brain rot it became. It felt like hanging out in a Facebook comments section.
Exactly. For me it was Cats (all animals, really) and Guitars.
Political discussions are far better on Lemmy.
Honestly I’m from the time where there used to be forums for these things and I liked forums just fine.
Same. I think it we moved back to forums the internet experience would improve
Agree. Another benefit is, it’s much less productive to use info-warfare bots against a small forum of let’s say 500 users, than against a global site with 1B users.
my little hometown somehow had a subreddit. i don’t know how
The good news is that if the fediverse gets an influx of Redditors, maybe we’ll see some of those niches pop up here too. Reddit’s impending identity theft coupled with the insane enforcement of rule 1 they’ve been doing lately is what got me to make my account here.
I wish there was a more active general gaming community here. I just migrated over from reddit, and haven’t found one that isn’t a ghost town.
In my infant span of figuring out how to get on here, there are some charms here like foodporn being on the main server, and shittyfoodporn being exclusively on the Canadian one.
Okay that’s pretty funny
Similar vein to forbidden snacks was don’t put your dick in that. Yeah I miss the niche subs too, don’t miss the rest of the bullshit tho.
E. Ask historians was also high grade.
I miss r/fitness. It was big enough but good enough to learn a lot and get motivation.
I miss the TV episode discussions. Even if I wasn’t following live, I could go read the thread and feel the shared excitement and read the theories and there was always something I hadn’t noticed that someone else had.
I miss those the most.
Same. I admit I circled back recently purely for the hype of Hazbin Season 2.
Fortunately, this season was shit so I didn’t spend long on there this time lol
Yeah I also liked the show subs where people theorized and discussed details.
I’ve been thinking of creating a new account through Tor, so that I could reconnect with my former communities who are still active there since, unfortunately, Reddit is still bigger than Lemmy. But with this new stupid identity verification rule from Reddit, I don’t think I will come back to the site.
I guess I will recreate the communities I’ve been missing here in Lemmy instead, which I have been thinking of doing for a long while now.
I’ve been thinking of creating a new account through Tor, so that I could reconnect with my former communities who are still active there since
Don’t create an account, use (or host) a Redlib instance, subscribe to your favourite subreddits and then bookmark it afterwards, that’s what I do.
Redlib
Ooo, this is the first I’ve heard of this but it looks really cool and promising! Get all the info and art without all the bots / bad users. I do miss the NIN commenters, but I’m also in their discord and there’s plenty of community to be found there!
Let’s go! We can all make Lemmy better.
I’ve been thinking the same thing, but I don’t even know how to do that
I think the first time someone had the idea of doing this to verify if you are not a bot is on YouTube 4-5 years ago (I’m not sure)
At least YouTube allows you to verify without giving any sort of data
If you upload on youtube then you need a google account. Which requires a phone number on a real smartphone.
I certainly don’t have my phone number associated with my Google account. Maybe grandfathered in, though?
Since when?
Not sure but you can try to make an account if you want but it asks you for a phone number and it pops up a button to send some system request to the phone so it’s not even a regular sms message it like sends it through some kind of system api
Hiding unpopular announcements in r/help isn’t enough, he has to post on his own account?
deleted by creator
Reddit should be rightly called Botdit
I’m glad to have completely weaned myself off of that bot-slop website
Get ready for the tankies and other assholes to scare off all the new users again :D
Usually when people leave reddit, many communists do come and find a much better place here. I think it’s good that we have a lot of left wing people here, and have little tolerance for right-wing and pro-imperialist views.
That’s how practically the entirety of the Internet was before it was monopolized and shoved into apps on smartphones. It was all leftists and hobbyists.
Yep, it’s kinda fun that way.
You mean a place where you can have intelligent discourse without somebody smearing shit all over while parroting Fox News talking points?
I wouldn’t say social media is a good space for intelligent conversations, haha.
Maybe my standards have been lowered by nextdoor. Nobody spelling you “ewe” because they’re using voice to text and not proof reading their brain diarrhea.
That’s fair, haha.
Do you prefer hanging out with the reactionaries?
Idk, y’all are not much better than Reddit. Just a different kind of sycophant here.
What are the problems with wanting production and distribution to be collectivized and oriented around needs, rather than profits? How is this comparable to Reddit?
I don’t think that part is the problem
Then what is?
I think he might be talking about the userbase.
(I agree 😬)
I disagree, then.
Every time this happens we gain new comrades while filtering out the worst of the insufferable reddit stereotypes to the reddit instances, thus keeping the rest of the fediverse clean. We are like mussel colonies filtering out fedora behavior. You’re welcome.
People who are “scared off” by leftwing politics are probably happier elsewhere anyway
These waves usually turn out better quality users than the lulls when we’re otherwise mostly getting the people who’ve been permabanned from Reddit. So, hopefully we get some good ones!
Hey. I’m high quality and I came from a permaban!
Personally offended !
Jk.
You’re banned!
New user here. Just approved and arrived. Greetings and salutations, folks 🙏🏻
Welcome! We’re happy to have you here.
Though I’m new here, lots of communities rules are copypasta from breddit, so what’s honestly different on here?
Many more communists and linux enthusiasts.
the damage is spread much thinner across the spaces. instead of one major peice of shit, you have many fiefdomes, and only most are smaller peices of shit.
but hey! there is always the next horizon. move to a better instance when needed
Less porn. Most of it seems to be from Reddit copy bots. So I guess that’s the real effect we are going to notice.
We don’t need more people, we need more good content!
There are so many ways to do human verification that have worked for years. The biggest reason bots are plaguing the internet is because these corpos don’t really try anymore. There’s literally no reason to do face scans or IDs other than to unanonymize people and take their data.
Name one way
Speak to a customer service agent while they ask you a few timed-dated questions
Video chat with a customer service agent.
if it’s a real name account:
Small credit card charge to a card in your name.
provide a scan of a utility bill
provide a scan of a car title
So instead of face scans or giving them my ID I have a video call with them and give them access to all my sensitive data? Am I missing something here?
all what sensitive data?
You don’t consider your credit card information sensitive data?
Not when you can generally make a 1 time use card, or a “virtual” card that most brands offer. Granted the only places I’ve seen this type of verification used is where you’re going to buy something anyways.
I give it to a dozen different vendors a month. It’s sitting in probably 20 vendors on the web right now just waiting for me to pay with it. I tell it to people over the phone. Giving it as a small charge, verification is the least of my worries.
All of Those are a deal breaker for me.
I could see the first one, if it all takes place in a chatbox. Like, they have someone talk to you in chat for a few minutes to verify if you pass the turing test, then randomly once a month do it again.
With the proper setup that would be acceptable.
Unfortunately they would have to pay people to do it so probably never happen. Although seeing them try to implement an LLM to try to tell if humans pass the Turing test would be kind of hilarious.
if all forms of verification are deal breakers, we either need to get laws made to make it unlawful, or we need to boycot services that require it.
The government is still going to do whatever it wants, and they already mishandle all your data.
Boycott, get around, defy, deny depose.
People forget that glass bottles and gasoline are (relatively) inexpensive
I don’t think we have enough gumption to actually do it, but here’s to hoping.
Deny, defy, depose…
Place age-verification on routers and keep it there.
Just open it all up to everyone. Fuck it. There’s a point we all just get bored of it
Wait, the guy at the top of the chain asked human verification, not age verification…
Any verification is wrong. Like everything in life, it will only impose a restriction on people who don’t have the ability to circumvent it at best. The only reason this would go forward is if it can be used against those people somehow. Data collection. Censorship.
Need to go the other way. Lean in not away. Look at why bots exist. Find ways to jam that system up. Like if it’s a bot trying to promote a new movie. Every comment should be shitting on that movie. If it’s a bot in November trying to post the latest drop ship night light star projector on r/coolstufftotallynotjustads well I’m pretty sure my cousin bought that lamp and was the reason his house burned down. For a couple years let’s fuck it all up. Make the internet inhospitable to politics, business, advertisers. If it’s some racist Facebook group, they pay ads to promote their bot group, so post it here on lemmy and report spam the group since they use bots to moderate. Chase them the fuck out. If they try to stop us it’ll cost them millions and us nothing to find new ways. Their option is to either restrict us to the point their platforms suck or they have to increase the number of bots costing them more and more and more until it’s not worth it. Go to fucking war with them and take the internet back instead of going the route of giving DNA samples to some 3rd party owned by meta just to look at porn.
I don’t know. I’m just done with it all. I like to image a world 20 years ago where we all saw the internet moving towards corporate interest and we chased them out. Instead they now create a problem and sell the solution and we all clap and fucking cheer
Hitler was much easier to kill as a baby. That’s all.
After I posted this I came across a topic that is likely filled with bots pumping it. Get in early. Look for indicators. Tag and bag them. But there’s needs to be some type of community for this. Like a scambaiters
“Famous Influencer Druski under flame for doing “Whiteface” after a video of him making fun of Erika Kirk surfaced online…”
How about at a random interval once every couple months it will ask you to draw a picture of a cat in the browser and if it finds your drawing process too similar or the image too similar to one that’s already in the database it will flag it without telling you. Three strikes and your out kinda rule. It’s like drug tests but for the internet.
Even if you did, like, a line across the screen to save time there’s no way in hell it’d be the same as anything else in that database unless you are extremely unlucky.
So you are suggesting captchas? I used to make a living running a bot farm and whenever my bots would be promoted with a captcha I’d have it solved by a service like 2captcha for the low cost of 0.3cents per captcha
Kinda, yeah. I was trying to come up with a captcha that’s hard for a bot but incredibly easy for a human. The random intervals was to make it harder to automate and that’s the idea I had off the top of my head. I just feel like captchas have had wasted potential for years and people kinda gave up on improving them.
Sorry dude, but this comment makes it clear you have no idea what you’re talking about. If I’m given an assignment to write a program that generates a huge variety of novel cat drawings, which won’t register the same in this database, I bet I could personally single handedly have that done in a week of work.
Some other problems :
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Many real humans will draw roughly similar cats. Unless you compare the drawings pixel by pixel, or very precisely, then there will be lots of false positives.
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If you then decide to compare the drawings pixel by pixel or very precisely, then I can trivially generate new drawings by altering them. I have plenty of time to reverse engineer how your database is comparing things even though you don’t tell me when I get a strike because I can make lots of fake accounts via hiding my IP address and run experiments by feeding different variations of drawings and seeing which ones eventually get banned.
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If you ask once every couple of months, then my bot gets to do three times whatever that duration of months is worth of damage and misinformation before it gets banned. That’s a pretty long time, especially for a bot. I can deploy new bots much faster than your system gets rid of them.
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As Anivia pointed out, I can pay real humans to draw the different cats for my bots when needed. This is especially trivial because I can just ask them to draw a whole bunch of cats in advance. I don’t even need to wait for the cue from the system. I can just have a big library of pre-drawn cat drawings that I upload as needed.
Cool, you don’t have to be a dick about it. :P I already know that I don’t know much about but I wanted to make a suggestion because the guy asked.
Sorry, I wasn’t trying to be a dick, just being honest. I felt it was important to correct your unjustified confidence in the original comment where you claimed many such solutions exist
But why do you need to talk down to me like I’m an idiot instead of just correct me politely? I’m genuinely curious because it seems to be a very common thing nowadays where percieved confident incorrectness and ignorance is met with distain and anger. I didn’t mean to offend anyone when I made this comment and was simply brainstorming while bored at work.
Let me first clarify that I think you seem very nice and I’m not mad at you, nor do I have any intent to make you feel bad. I think you’re misreading my tone, tbh. That or I’m expressing my tone poorly.
So, I thought I did correct you politely, within the bounds of also needing to make very clear and unambiguous that you needed to adjust your confidence when talking about this subject. I have no issue with someone idly brainstorming ideas, but in the context of your original comment “There are so many ways to do human verification that have worked for years.”, which you didn’t qualify in any way, you sounded completely authoritative and sure of yourself. Since you yourself even know that you are ignorant on this topic, to me a better phrasing would be to preface that with something like “I think…” Or “It seems like…”, or even outright saying “I don’t really know about this stuff, but…” Etc.
Because you made a dumb claim with confidence. You were talked down to because you were acting like a fool. Which you’re still doing btw.
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Captchas back in the day were solved by humans in bot farms. Yes they are humans but not the right ones.
That was kinda my idea with the whole random and unexpected checking in. It’s easy to get humans to do it for bot farms when you have deterministic times in which you’d have to perform the captcha. Nowadays most simple captchas can be done by bots so I was brainstorming a way you could make it harder for the bots while being minimally intrusive to the user.
It’s really weird to me how literally anything they say or do is immediately interpreted in the worst possible way here, on Lemmy.
Let’s get real for a second.
Is there a bot problem on the Internet in general? That’s a resounding “yes”.
Do we want to do something about it?
According to OP - no, not at all.
I mean, if OP considers malicious everything that Spez listed, the only remaining course of action is inaction and hoping for the best.
“We can’t let the terrorists win!!”
You’d really hand over your government ID to Spez? Lmao
Did you not read anything from the linked post, or did you fail to understand it?
Who says anything about government ID?
You’re right in theory, but it’s Spez we’re talking about. I tend to consider that the following is a rational reaction to Spez preparing to take any action about anything in any context:
There is a bot problem but ID checks are invasive, and you can stop the bots with things like Hcaptcha Passive and Turnstile which use POW to waste the CPU cycles of bots and look for signs of things like Selenium and Puppeteer controlling the browser.
This is not ID checks.
FFS, do you guys just not understand a thing you’re reading, or flat out refuse to read anything on Reddit?
Who says anything about ID checks or HCaptchas?
Well, it looks like they state three options:
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Passkeys. This won’t work over a medium term, period. It’s tantamount to saying that SSH keys prove someone is human. If there’s enough interest, they’ll just make a software passkey solution that can work. Passkey being “human interactive” is purely a client-side construct.
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Biometric services. Strictly speaking, not an ID but it’s not hard to imagine leveraging capturing biometrics to an ID like scenario.
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Government IDs. Well that’s self explanatory.
They do state distancing themselves from the ID by trusting a third party service, but 3rd party ID service is still a thing.
Of course, this seems to be only after someone accuses you of being a bot and Reddit bothering to pay attention. Which may be almost no one.
Precisely. Any of the listed options is better than a captcha. None of the options are perfect, obviously, we’re using yesterday’s tech to solve a tomorrow’s problem, but it’s something, and it doesn’t immediately mean “privacy online is dead”.
I’d rather put up with a captcha than do any on those other things, especially if it was temporary. Or maybe they could do something like Anubis
Why would it be temporary?
One you prove your not a bot. Hopefully it work that way, but I suppose it may not
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Passkeys and hardware attestation are also good as they require a fingerprint or face and bare metal hardware instead of a VM, but Spez also wants to introduce things like the Worldcoin Orb and IDs as well which are too invasive IMO.
https://lemmy.ml/post/45007584/24779562
You have to read between the lines. This just gives them the option to label anybody they want as a “bot” with virtually no way to challenge them. They can now ban anybody they wish for posting content they don’t agree with (pro-gaza, anti-israel, anti-capitalist, etc).
If it’s a third party tool that does the verification, that’s false.
Ironically the only thing that will ever work is identifying a user to a person in one form or another. Otherwise it’s just a never ending arms race.
Yup! Which is why institutions that already handle identities (governments, banks, etc) should be involved.
The way I see it: an institution verifies your identity as a human and has your personal details (such as DoB). A tool (similar to, e.g. Sweden’t BankID) is available to the user. When a website says “you must be 18 years old to access this”, a QR code is generated. You scan the code with your tool, and agree to send only the information about whether or not you’re an adult. Not the DoB, not anything else, just a token of “yup, adult”. If a website has a strong anti-bot policy, same same goes for your “proof of human”.
This can be set up in a way that guarantees the user’s privacy (e.g. by just not storing any logs).
Yes but how does that prevent the authority, in this case a govenment, from being able to link the token that was used (QR code) back to what it was used for?
Depends on how you create it. It could be set up that your app talks to the website, and the identity provider, but the identity provider never talks to the website. As in: you get a token from the IP, store it locally, send it out to he website, the website confirms retrieval and logs you in, and then all the logs get purged on your device so they can’t be retrieved.
The IP side would only see that someone has requested access to some of your data (e.g. proof of age, proof of human, maybe citizenship, if the content is region-locked), and that you have agreed to share it.
The website would only see the tokens of proof, but not who you actually are.
Ironically, the tech behind NFTs might be super helpful with this.
If I am understanding this correctly, I guess the only problem I see with that is both entities need to trust that the user is indeed being truthful and not sharing a token. I think a system with a neutral third part that takes a token from the identity provider and a token from the webite, validates them and sends a result. Or maybe that is what you said.
its kinda funny. theoretically I would love for a system that can identify real humans but realistically im unwilling to submit to the type of trump it would entail.
This is pretty uncontroversial as far as reddit announcements go. They aren’t requiring identity verification.
