however, just like the severity of punishment, after a point the more police you have see diminishing returns, and in serious over policing cases you start to get more crime because they start looking for reasons to hand out fines and smaller charges to justify/fund their job. However, prosperity reduces the amount of crime more than anything, in a given population.

Supporting male dominance is part of their real job.

That’s a pig’s job. I’ve watched those motherfuckers forge documents. They show up, shit on people, then cover up their misconduct and idiocy.

If they are only preventing opportunity, the crime will just take place at a different place or time when an officer is not present. The program’s mentioned are aimed at reducing the motive for crime, which applies at all places and times.

The threat of violence from police and incarceration by police are also associated with the presence you mention. These also prevent crime from happening.

The “problem” is that it’s physically impossible to have police everywhere, all the time, for that prevention to be meaningful. It’s diminishing returns and exponential cost. So programs to prevent people from turning to crime, like jobs programs, pay so they aren’t suffering in poverty, affordable and accessible mental health and regular health care, addiction treatment, decent housing, etc. are the logical next steps.

But no. We just hire more cops, give them more guns, and the equivalent of military armored vehicles. They choose violence.

Take it a step back…the root cause of most crime (or at least non-white-collar property crime) is social and economic inequality, which is now and has forever been driven by the wealthy ruling class.

Rich people cause all the crime.

I mean you can also say that that threat of jail does prevent people from committing crimes. But this seems like a pretty hyperbolic group, not really a lot of room for nuance. A lot of these ACAB people could see a cop sacrificing his life to save an orphanage full of children and still call him evil for being part of a broken system with bad people in it.

Is this fact or feeling?

People I know that work with criminals attest that the vast majority of crimes are opportunistic encounters by ordinary people and “career criminality” is rare.

Of course “I know people who say” isn’t much fact either but it’s more then nothing.

It seems pointless to argue this. Clearly it is true some of the time and not true others. Even some of the opportunistic petty stuff could have been prevented by timely interventions, especially social welfare programs

However There is evidence that “broken windows” policing doesn’t work, and “stop and frisk” just breeds resentment

But imagine if police had a good reputation for helping people, lived up to “protect and serve”, actually were a thin blue line keeping civilization civil, cared about preventing crime, investigating crime, seeing justice done. Imagine if they spent their time on issues that matter. Imagine if they were able to handle substance abuse and mental illness for the good of the victims, connect the desperate up with social welfare programs. Just by slogans alone we could have a much better world while preventing a huge portion of crime.

🎵Write to me, Stick Stickly, PO box 963, New York City, New York State, 10108!🎵

They also escalate crime. By a lot.

Welfare checks. Minor incidents. Petty theft.

Suddenly it’s a dead guy.

Cops do not like confronting actual criminals - criminals are dangerous. But they love to intimidate and force total acquiescence from regular people and excuse it by saying ‘its what we have to do ‘in case’ they are a criminal’.

Once criminals figure out that cops don’t want to confront them, those criminals learn to accommodate that. So they get worse. They figure out who they can rob and intimidate with impunity - and it’s mostly the poor. But also, they can break into middle class people’s cars, porch pirate, even B&E into homes, and cops don’t want to deal with that. So many people post on reddit bc cops won’t do a thing if, for example, a disabled person has their motorized wheelchair stollen, so people try to play detective on their own. Have a stalker or an ex who has credibly threatened your life? That might only help them catch that person if you are actually murdered.

Cops deter crime in wealthy areas, but the rest of us are on our own.

Fear of being caught might deter the naive from testing if they can get away with shit, but in reality, there is essentially a truce between cops and criminals, and if you know how to be too much work and risk to bother catching, a lot of what we consider ‘criminals’ don’t have a lot to worry about.

Those kinds of crimes are exceedingly rare, and many (such as rampage killings) are the result of systemic issues that could be addressed in other ways (not merely just regulating firearm access).

I don’t think you could have a successful society without laws, and you need someone to enforce those laws

This is a very post Renaissance take.

This is saying police aren’t the answer to solving all crime and that the need for them would be greatly reduced if a society were to look after it’s people instead of leaving them to wallow in misery and strife. It’s not anti police to say that at all. Police are misused in many societies as a tool for all situations and then teach them only how to be a hammer.

No, but it doesn’t mean I’ll never speed again as soon as im out of their view. I’d say at best they delayed a crime from happening. But I get how that has its legitimate usefulness too.

Folks temporarily slow down until they’re gone. Which causes traffic jams and accidents.

How does that apply to cameras used as deterrents? They’re present the whole time.

They’re not a very good one considering how they have a very poor case closure rate for serious violent crimes, and the state and federal justice systems of the US are disturbingly okay with false convictions and excessive retribution.

both are true?

Postponed, supressed or relocated potentially but not prevented and when crimes are postponed or supressed as such the desperation increases resulting in more violent and destructive crimes.

The only way to prevent crime is to deal with the conditions that cause it.

It’s probably accurate to say that police create more crime than they prevent

In all fairness, this one time whilst living in London (UK) the police did recover my stolen bicycle.

Frankly I totally didn’t expect it and had only reported the theft to make sure it ended up in the theft statistics.

I’ve been commuting by bicycle on and off for over 2 decades and got maybe 5 or 6 bicycles stollen in the meanwhile and this was the only one I ever got back.

A bike? I had the same reaction trying to report my car stolen. Not worth their time. They couldn’t even cross reference their own data - a couple weeks later I was ticketed for abandoning my stripped car and charged for towing and storage fees. Reporting my car stolen was just an income source to them and I had to keep paying so it wouldn’t keep adding up

My friend had his bike stolen. He insisted on filing a police report even though the cops were clearly annoyed and straight up told him it was pointless. A couple months later he saw his bike chained up on the main street in his neighborhood. There were 2 cops out on the street so he approached them and explained the situation. One laughed at him and said, “What do you want us to do about it?” The other told him he would have to provide proof that that specific bike was his and that it wasn’t just the same brand which is basically impossible.

Then he said, “We won’t be here much longer. Just go buy some bolt cutters and steal it back.”

I used to roll my eyes when Redditors posted anti-police sentiment, I thought they were just being edgy. Turn out they were right.

Glad you recognize the problem.

I was pretty “cops are kinda okay” to full blown ACAB after this story, where a my neighbor, a man in a wheelchair, was shot 9 times in the back of the head because Ryan Remington has a trigger finger.

9 times. In the back. 60 yo man in a wheelchair. And Ryan Remington is still Scott free.

Thanks for sharing this experience.

People think I’m being dramatic when I say a police officer can choose to ruin your whole life, and the lives of your friends and family, just because they feel like it.

Nobody should have that kind of power.