Why are you so smug while plugging your ears and kicking your feet? Would you kill the animals you eat with your own two hands? I doubt that most would. We’re so far removed from the horrific violence of the industry and so inundated with farmed meat that people don’t even register what it actually is anymore. This isn’t even to mention that animal meat is carcinogenic, particularly in the amounts we eat. We don’t have a problem with people being anti-smoking or anti-violence, but as soon as “loud annoying” vegan asks you to reflect on the environment, people’s health, or the nightmarish violence we inflict on farmed animals, it’s absolute pandemonium from the meat eaters.
IMO most don’t/won’t want to deal with the cognitive dissonance.
What’s more apt? Demand? I literally never see a “militant” vegan emerge anywhere unless in a thread like this which demonizes a (diverse) group of people for giving a shit about animals and this planet. I think that most people who give thought to this problem will eventually realize that they aren’t primal hunters capable of taking the life of animals, let alone a new animal or more every day.
Two things. First, the fact most people arent hunting the animals thenselves really isnt shocking. Human society thrives on specialization. We dont farm or forage our own veggies either, we dont engineer our own cars, we dont construct our own houses. Thats kinda just how civilization works. Its not uniquely symptomatic of “carnists”.
Secondly, you severely underestimate people. Primitive tribes, even if they were less effective at securing large amounts of meat, still hunted without any moral compunctions about the matter. Evolution is a slow thing, people who did that were just like us in any way that matters. Its not unreasonable to assume most people would adjust if you strip away the automation of society. Desperate people resort to cannibalism for goodness sake, I wouldnt put hunting past them.
I am not remotely arguing against subsistence farming or hunting. Hell even hunting meat yourself that you consume. I wouldn’t do it willingly, but that doesn’t make it inherently immoral.
People are detached from the method of making their meat. It is far more unpleasant than most want to think about. The animals are mistreated. It’s hard to argue they aren’t. That’s really the point
I am underestimating no one. I do not remotely doubt humanity’s capacity for violence and depravity. I am saying that we as people can choose to minimize harm and violence (to each other, animals we farm, etc)
edit: I should also point out that we are FAR past the point of “subsistence” with out meat consumption. We consume more meat now than ever before. There are many costs associated with this to our health, the animals we eat, the planet …
Then why are you trying so hard to explain yourself?
Why are you so smug while plugging your ears and kicking your feet? Would you kill the animals you eat with your own two hands? I doubt that most would. We’re so far removed from the horrific violence of the industry and so inundated with farmed meat that people don’t even register what it actually is anymore. This isn’t even to mention that animal meat is carcinogenic, particularly in the amounts we eat. We don’t have a problem with people being anti-smoking or anti-violence, but as soon as “loud annoying” vegan asks you to reflect on the environment, people’s health, or the nightmarish violence we inflict on farmed animals, it’s absolute pandemonium from the meat eaters.
IMO most don’t/won’t want to deal with the cognitive dissonance.
That word is doing some heavy lifting. What does asking look like to you?
What’s more apt? Demand? I literally never see a “militant” vegan emerge anywhere unless in a thread like this which demonizes a (diverse) group of people for giving a shit about animals and this planet. I think that most people who give thought to this problem will eventually realize that they aren’t primal hunters capable of taking the life of animals, let alone a new animal or more every day.
Two things. First, the fact most people arent hunting the animals thenselves really isnt shocking. Human society thrives on specialization. We dont farm or forage our own veggies either, we dont engineer our own cars, we dont construct our own houses. Thats kinda just how civilization works. Its not uniquely symptomatic of “carnists”.
Secondly, you severely underestimate people. Primitive tribes, even if they were less effective at securing large amounts of meat, still hunted without any moral compunctions about the matter. Evolution is a slow thing, people who did that were just like us in any way that matters. Its not unreasonable to assume most people would adjust if you strip away the automation of society. Desperate people resort to cannibalism for goodness sake, I wouldnt put hunting past them.
I am not remotely arguing against subsistence farming or hunting. Hell even hunting meat yourself that you consume. I wouldn’t do it willingly, but that doesn’t make it inherently immoral.
People are detached from the method of making their meat. It is far more unpleasant than most want to think about. The animals are mistreated. It’s hard to argue they aren’t. That’s really the point
I am underestimating no one. I do not remotely doubt humanity’s capacity for violence and depravity. I am saying that we as people can choose to minimize harm and violence (to each other, animals we farm, etc)
edit: I should also point out that we are FAR past the point of “subsistence” with out meat consumption. We consume more meat now than ever before. There are many costs associated with this to our health, the animals we eat, the planet …
Sorry, I’m not going to participate if you’re going to be abusive.
Abusive? 😂 I accept your apology.