If you have no preferred pronouns, just say (none) or something
This will help make people feel more comfortable in this comm and has a side effect of showing you support trans people when making comments in other communities. It will also make reactionaries seethe and make it easier for mods to purge them, and make trans people feel safer all over the fediverse.
Suggestions for when it becomes too long? Would ♂ work? I have 4 extra characters to work with.
With the standard length being 24 characters " [he/him]" would reduce it to 15 characters, " [she/her]" to 14 and " [they/them]" to 12 characters, which is really short for a username imo.
Lemm.ee apparently has it further reduced to 20.
could do (he)
🤦 thanks
np 💖
Looking at this thread and thinking about the long, laborious work our transgender mods are doing and will have to continue doing to clean this place up
respect.This is unenfoceable and you can see in your own headline why. Why call it a rule? is this a reference to Bill Maher? if so, please stop referencing that loathsome removed, he does not deserve your time of day in any way, shape or form.
This is completely enforceable, the only instance I know of that doesn’t allow changing your display name is Hexbear and that’s cuz we use that field for displaying pronouns lol
loathsome removed
Maher? I have no clue.
Its absolutely enforceable, funny coming from a hexbear tbh, you have it in your ID right now 🤷♀️
I know I have it in my bio, because I am in agreement with it since before you made it a rule.
Your own headline says that not all instances have this as an option. That makes it unenforceable for those instances. It is also unenforceable for anyone wandering in from a main page, because they won’t be reading this rule before posting. And then sure you can delete their post I guess but what if it wasn’t transphobic?
And if you don’t know Bill Maher, good. Just know that he is a ghoul and loves to say ‘new rule’ and then spout the worst take you have heard in your life on a weekly basis.
I know I have it in my bio, because I am in agreement with it since before you made it a rule.
Your own headline says that not all instances have this as an option. That makes it unenforceable for those instances. It is also unenforceable for anyone wandering in from a main page, because they won’t be reading this rule before posting. And then sure you can delete their post I guess but what if it wasn’t transphobic?
And if you don’t know Bill Maher, good. Just know that he is a ghoul and loves to say ‘new rule’ and then spout the worst take you have heard in your life on a weekly basis.
I can’t watch maher cuz his gob makes my heart pump and my punchin’ arm shake something fierce.
Man why couldnt Will Smith have slapped him? That was a great slap.
I couldve have that as my desktop background rn
Your own headline says that not all instances have this as an option. That makes it unenforceable for those instances. It is also unenforceable for anyone wandering in from a main page, because they won’t be reading this rule before posting. And then sure you can delete their post I guess but what if it wasn’t transphobic?
The post wont be removed, but I will suggest they change name. Repeated infractions might mean a removal, though, and if someone reports their instance can’t do it, their instance will be ignored for the rule. The purpose is to make a safer space, we’ll see if it works
And if you don’t know Bill Maher, good. Just know that he is a ghoul and loves to say ‘new rule’ and then spout the worst take you have heard in your life on a weekly basis.
👼 I am innocent
I know I have it in my bio, because I am in agreement with it since before you made it a rule.
Your own headline says that not all instances have this as an option. That makes it unenforceable for those instances. It is also unenforceable for anyone wandering in from a main page, because they won’t be reading this rule before posting. And then sure you can delete their post I guess but what if it wasn’t transphobic?
And if you don’t know Bill Maher, good. Just know that he is a ghoul and loves to say ‘new rule’ and then spout the worst take you have heard in your life on a weekly basis.
Although I’m a cis woman, I have never felt especially pleased with being lumped into this category. I have never listed my pronouns before, ever, and I avoid listing my gender if possible, because I do not want the first thing people to know about me be my gender and then view me through that lens. I have always appreciated the trans community overlooks my femaleness and sees me instead.
I am not nonbinary; I do not prefer they/them. I use she/her, but I don’t want to advertise this. I have my own struggles with gender, even if I’m ultimately cis, and forcing me to report my gender in my username seems frankly gender essentialist.
What should I write? (none) is wrong, because I can be referred to with pronouns.
(ally) might be nice, except in LGBTIA+, “Ally” implies being straight, and I’m not straight.
How about an empty ()? to indicate I acknowledge the system but opt out personally. Or something cute like (comrade)
an empty () is completely valid, imo. or even (friend) or (ally) or (any) or something. i definitely would recommend discussing with yor, she could probably help explain why this is a rule, but i get you.
You can be a she/her NB btw. If you feel a disconnect with your gender or don’t feel connected to it, you’re free to consider yourself trans.
Anyways, I don’t see any problem with avoiding pronouns. Personally, I used to be in that camp - I wanted to be supportive of trans people, but I didn’t want to list he/him, but didn’t think I was trans enough to use other pronouns… So I just did not put them.
(ally) might be nice, except in LGBTIA+, “Ally” implies being straight, and I’m not straight.
This could be interpreted as aro/ace erasure/exclusion btw by putting the word “Ally” so close to the acronym.
Aro/ace are valid and are LGBTIA+. What I mean is, “ally” implies straight, and I’m not.
Gender is a spectrum, and I consider myself cis, even if there are others more cis than me. Most of my troubles with gender come from me feeling society is at fault for treating me differently because of my sex. I think most educated women express such opinions, and that doesn’t make us enbies.
Fair. I think it’s quite reasonable women hide they’re women on the internet given how they are often treated. Just wanted to point out NBies are a wide spectrum and what pronouns you use doesn’t need to dictate your gender.
Guess it could it be comparable to being a 1 or 6 on the Kinsey scale and not considering yourself bi because the label doesn’t convey any useful information about your attraction? Imo, which label you choose at that point is up to you and I don’t think it seems biphobic or NBphobic to choose one of the binary labels.
on hex there’s both a comrade option and a use name option. the latter seems particularly relevant based on what you said
“use name,” I infer, is “jsomae was talking about jsomae’s day and mentioned jsomae saw a…” sort of thing. I would rather be assumed male than this. (Though if others prefer this for themselves, I approve in that case)
fair enough, also .ml isn’t my instance so I don’t wanna be too pushy on whether options like friend or comrade are preferred here. @[email protected] might be better to weigh in specifics like that
tho I do wanna go back to this real quick
I go by she/her, but I don’t want to advertise this. I have my own struggles with gender, even if I’m ultimately cis, and forcing me to report my gender in my username seems frankly gender essentialist.
pronouns, in this case, are really just used to know how to refer to you. if I were referring to you without seeing your above comments I’d probably avoid pronouns (none/use name). other people who are mindful of this would end up doing the same or maybe using they/them to be safe. in person, it sounds like you don’t have the issue of needing to provide pronouns (with many complicated feelings on that). in the same way that you say the trans community sees you as a person and not simply your assigned gender at birth, this isn’t a request to box you in or anything like that. this community isn’t binary focused or gender essentialist. it’s just how would you like us to talk about you? if that’s something you’re not sure on, maybe a label like (it’s complicated) or something acknowledging it’s a complex topic for you. it doesn’t have to mean you’re not cis to feel weird about the weight of the expected gender binary in society. that can hurt trans and cis people alike
One way or another, Lemmy has many communities. Even if you don’t have any preconceptions about women, others will. And even if it’s all in my head and nobody on lemmy has such prejudices – she/her isn’t my identity, but my username is. jsomae is how I choose to present to the world, and I don’t want femininity to be a part of how I present.
then to ask simply, how do you want people to refer to you when talking to you online?
Exactly the same way I expect people to know I’m Canadian. That is to say, I expect people to call me she/her if they recognise me or in the rare event my sex is relevant and surfaces (“my experience as a woman is…”).
Pragmatically, most people will he/him me if they are Neanderthalpilled and they/them me if they are based, as is the rule online. :P (and those he/himmers will assume I’m American as well.)
I understand your point of view more than most of the arguments I’ve seen against mandatory pronouns. So please take my comment as friendly, I’ll do my best not to be a rude asshole.
How would you feel about (any) for your pronoun choice? That’s functionally the same as not listing them, people can still choose which ones they want to use for you, but it still shows you’re supportive of people prominently displaying their pronouns. That or you could consider maybe a neopronoun. I personally really like e/em/eir. They’re nice and genderless, easy to use, and, bonus, a mathematician came up with them in like the '70s (I could have the year wrong and I refuse to look it up), not because he was trying to be trans inclusive, but because he hated that math books assumed their readers were all men and he wanted to include women in his writing. (Singular they was considered ungrammatical at that point.)
I would not have assumed you’re a rude asshole based on the rest of your comment – but either way, thank you for being friendly.
I don’t like (any) as that means I acquiesce to the years of being assumed male by default on the Internet. I feel spite about that not because I feel euphoric when she/her’d but rather at a more base level of feminism – that male-by-default is a patriarchal practice and so I object to it. If I were ok with (any) then I’d be OK with he/him. As a cis woman, he/him doesn’t cause me dysphoria, it just causes me to roll my eyes at the state of the world. Making my pronouns visible isn’t a fix for this, it’s just a band-aid as it doesn’t magically cause the world to be less sexist. Honestly, getting he/him’d by default is basically a useful litmus test for the state of sexism in a community I guess.
I’m not interested in changing my pronouns to a neopronoun or to any other pronoun really, but it’s a nice suggestion and the aside about the mathematician is really interesting. As a mathematician myself I approve of the etymology. :)
sharing your pronouns is the very least you can do to show support to trans comrades, so this small request shouldn’t be an issue at all
Can yall stop pushing your beliefs on people /lh
what is lh
Light hearted
oh ok thanks!
Yw
you can change your username? but i like my username the way it is. so if i did this, i’d be like, [email protected]? bit of a mouthful, innit?
No, there’s your username and the thing that’s displayed above your posts. My username is apotheotic, my display name is apotheotic (she/her)
huh, okay, today i learned. now that you’ve mentioned it i do see your display name if i click through to your user page, but not on your posts/comments, and idk how to change mine, but if other folks can see that, i’ll look into it if i see a way.
this would be a good case for lemmy to start supporting flairs like reddit does. No shame in copying legitimately useful features.
The displayed username is different from the internal one. Im [email protected] but once i figure out how to do this it will display me as mathemachristian (he/him)@lemm.ee but internally refer to me still as [email protected]
edit: got my accounts mixed up but the point is the same
0·3 months agoDisplay names can, by default at least (on hexbear its 80 I think), be at most 24 chars long
I understand the sentiment and would respect the decision, even if I don’t agree, but there are problems of consistency. You say people should make new accounts if necessary to explore their trans identity, but you’ll allow instance wide exemptions.
It would be nice if proper support for pronouns was added in the first place, but that’s also clearly not going to become a priority unless people openly demand it, so here we are with an inconsistent compromise.
Pretty much every IRL trans space I’ve ever been in has started with name + pronouns, it’s not a big ask and it normalizes being respectful of other people.
Sorry, I didn’t want to make a bad faith argument, but I think it’s necessary to clarify the issue.
The exemption will allow bigots from those instances to still have access and the benefit of doubt. People who might have valid reasons to not disclose openly their position will have to create a new account.
If pronouns are a safety measure, there’s a big flaw in making exemptions. Will the users know the people they are talking are not marked because they can’t be.
Just a thought. Maybe make it a required opener or signature.
(he / him / queer)
I do like the idea of mandating including pronouns in your first post in a thread if your instance doesn’t support them, rather than an exemption
I don’t really consider requiring pronouns to be a safety measure, more of a vibes check.
Frankly considering how normalized being transphobic on main is, I like the idea of pushing people to being supportive of trans people on main.
Ahhh sweet redoing the pronouns struggle session on another instance
More for the purges I assume
I’m all about it
Alright maybe, not “rule” as in hard coded and enforced by moderators, “rule” as in social norm.
Maybe?
My username says it already. I wish everyone the best.
[Sincere] why when they can be in my bio?
The issue is people have to click your name to see it, if its in your ID people can see it immediately. lowers risk for misgendering and people can see what you prefer at a glance. also, at a glance, people will know you support trans people
Okay, thank you for explaining!
no problem, any time
why do people in general need to know this at a glance? Can they not tell by the content of my posts that I support trans people? I thought this rule was to help mods make quick judgments.
quick judgments, see if someone is trans supportive, also helps gender you right
I didn’t even notice you could alter your display name like this. Almost a year here and somehow missed this feature.
thanks for the info! we’re trying to work within the constraints we have
I just did (might take some time to propagate)
💖
Any idea if that’s something I can do on slrpnk.net? I’m on mobile right now, and not seeing an option.
You might have to login on desktop, I’m not familiar with solar punk (and if people mention their instance doesnt allow name changes i’ll make a tally of instances that dont and are exempt) but if you go to your settings usually it will have an editable text box for your display name
it doesn’t want to save my changes 🤔
There is a limit to how long usernames/nicknames can be on lemmy. You might have to only do like NOOBMASTER (she) or some shorter nickname for it to let you save it.
I guess you were right, thanks!
