Obama: Stuck his head WAY out left in his first campaign, running on left-populist reform of the entire system to the benefit of the little people who had been ignored in favor of the rich and powerful for many decades. Huge landslide victory with historically high voter participation borne by the left as much as black people.
There was nothing vague about his messaging: he was there to reform it all to the left. Until he was sworn in, that is 😮💨
0 of 4. You’re really bad at this.
Hillary: here we go again with your headsticking schtick. She ran on the right wing flank of the Dem party. Especially compared to her Primary opponent Bernie (who pollled much better in the head to heads against Trump btw).That’s not being disputed by anyone but you.
0 out of 5. Man, you SUCK at this! Gonna make it 0 of 6? I bet you are.
Biden: Biden had the good fortune of running against the most unpopular incumbent since right after Gerald Ford pardoned Nixon. Most of the country hated Trump and all Biden had to do was not be Trump. Using exactly that as his main strategy, he eked out a very narrow win that wouldn’t have been possible without the left showing up and voting against Trump rather than for Biden.
And no, he hasn’t been governing from the left! He’s barely even been governing from the left AISLE 🤦
0 out of 6. Congratulations! You’re a colossal idiot and/or delusional! 🥳
people are amazed that they don’t run an extreme left platform?
Damn, that’s one gigantic strawman! Only ONE US presidential candidate has ever run on an “extreme left” platform and that was the socialist Eugene V. Debs.
Every time they stick their head out a little itsy bitsy tiny bit left they lose
Again, categorically false. Apart from Obama, the most successful president in the history of the country was FDR, who was also the most economically left wing one ever.
So how do you get them to move left? By giving them victories. Consistent and overwhelming victories.
Yeah sure. The corporatist Dems are gonna go left if we just continue to reward them for being center-right to right wing 🙄
Because when they lose, like they’ve lost 20 years out of the last 24 years, they will go to the centre to find votes.
No. Win or lose, they’ll always go to the right. Since 1992 their main focus has consistently been almost-republican “swing voters”.
Even as the GOP have drifted further and further right to the point that they’re now a literal fascist party, the DNC have been dogging their heels, picking up crumbs at the left flank of the GOP while leaving behind entire loaves at their own in their quest for this ever-shrinking “moderate Republican” demographic.
The Dems lost the house of representatives in Obama’s years 3 and 4. Again in years 5 and 6. And then lost both the house of representatives and the Senate in Obama’s years 7 and 8.
They lost control in 3 out of 4 elections under Obama.
Exactly. The ones after he’d started governing and running as a moderate rather than a progressive. You’re literally making my point for me.
There is more than just the presidential election you know
Wow, what a keen insight! I had no idea! 🙄
The left voters never showed up after the first election.
The left didn’t abandon Obama. He abandoned the left long before the mid term elections. He filed the divorce papers and then the DNC was shocked that the invitation for a second honeymoon was rejected.
AKA the left voters never show up [after the first election].
Except the left showed up 4 times for the one president who ran on unapologetically left wing economics from start to finish.
You’re acting like the left not rewarding the leadership for breaking with them is the fault of the voters, not the people whose job it is to earn votes. That’s victim blaming and also a fundamental misunderstanding of how politics works.
I’m informing you that when Dems lose they go to the center.
Nope, you’re spewing falsehoods and misunderstandings to me. I don’t know how much is deliberate disinformation, but you’re not informing, you’re misinforming.
I’m telling left people how to be effective
Why do you keep repeating that obvious lie? You’re not giving advice. You’re spewing falsehoods and misunderstandings.
Dems had control for 4 years of the last 24 years. For filibuster proof control, Dems had control for 4 MONTHS of the last 24 years.
This is why Dems compromise and reach across the aisle, because they basically never have control.
You’ve got the causality backwards there, bub. Dems have so little control because they compromise and become GOP Lite, which isn’t what voters want.
Dem voters want someone further left and GOP voters want FULLY fascist candidates. This inbetween bullshit is costing them SO many elections that should have been easily winnable and would have been if they hadn’t run as pro-choice Republicans.
To get literally anything done they need to compromise.
They wouldn’t if they stopped running to the right of the majority of their prospective voters.
And you wonder why they have to compromise? And why they go to the centre on the next election?
Not at all, no. The DNC is a for-profit private corporation masquerading as a nonprofit public party. They’re in it for the money and it’s more profitable to do what the richest 10% want than listening to the other 90%.
If you want progress you have to give Dems overwhelming and consistent victories
Got it backwards again. If Dems want overwhelming and consistent victories, they’re going to have to take a left turn on almost all policy positions to meet tye public where they am instead of demanding that the public reward them for being awful but less awful than the alternative.
6 years out of the last 44 fucking years that Dems had control
Which makes sense since 44 years ago was when they stopped being a center left bordering on social democratic party and started being a center right to right wing neoliberal party.
Where do you think things would be if Gore won? It would be further left.
He did win.. If he hadn’t immediately conceded, a lot of things WOULD be better though, yes.
Where do you think things would be if Hilary won? It would be further left.
On the other hand, things would have been MUCH further left if Hillary hadn’t been the nominee. Or if she hadn’t elevated Trump and had instead lost to Jeb or someone like that.
People need to stop waiting for this left candidate that’s they think is going to magically appear (and until then they will logically protest no-vote).
You’re describing maybe .001% of the population there. That’s not what the left is doing.
If you want things to go left you give Dems wins consistently and overwhelmingly.
Again, no. You don’t make people stop being awful by rewarding them for it
Every time they lose they go to the center.
Every time they lose it’s because they went to the right wing area they call the center.
A center voter is worth double, because it’s both a vote for you and a vote taken away from the other party
Except that there’s no way that anyone who’s on the fence about TRUMP would ever vote for a Democrat. They’ve been convinced that Democrats are all evil. Otherwise they wouldn’t consider an outright fascist who says that Dems are trying to kill everyone.
Do you want the Dems to move left?
Obviously. Unlike you.
Then be the voter that shows up
Again, already am.
so that the Dems don’t lose and have to go to the center to find voters.
Other way around: they lose because they keep going further and further right, alienating their own base and especially young voters. If the Dems cared more about winning and losing than they do about big donations, they would have moved left and started consistently winning DECADES ago.
In conclusion: of the dozens of times that you were dropped on your head as a child, how many would you say were deliberate?
In conclusion: of the dozens of times that you were dropped on your head as a child, how many would you say were deliberate?
You’re a colossal idiot and/or delusional! 🥳
Ah I skimmed through and see your jabs and insults. There’s no good faith discussion when you rely on this, so we’ll see what I respond to (and this will be my last reply, after I report your comment).
Jimmy Carter didn’t just lose, he was unceremoniously punted the fuck out. That’s the left voters not showing up.
Bill Clinton. What are you even suggesting? Charisma? He won because he went to the center. Many people here say he went right past center and went to the right. That’s what he had to do to find votes.
Oh we had President Gore? You can talk about courts all day, we did not have President Gore. Thanks protest 3rd party voters!
Oh you do another jab.
Obama was broad “hope”, thinking that was enough after the wars. And after those wars that was all was necessary. And what did his first 2 years of ACA get him? Voters that didn’t show up for his years 3-8. AKA left voters didn’t show up.
Oh you do another jab.
Hilary after seeing voters not show up for Obama’s years 3-8 stuck her head a little left on the one issue that supposedly matters to logical leftists: Climate Change. And guess what: The. Left. Voters. Did. Not. Show. Up.
And a big jab. Yeah this will be my last reply when you act like that.
Biden, like i said when you run against an incumbent you run center. If he ran left, who know what would have happened.
Oh yeah no subtleness there, you just go for insults. Definitely report and last reply. No logical discourse is possible. I’ll hurry this up and skip over the rest of your insults and whatever else.
Yeah sure. The corporatist Dems are gonna go left if we just continue to reward them for being center-right to right wing 🙄
I can say it again, they go center because they keep losing. They’ve lost 20 of the last 24 years. So they go to the center to find votes. Because guess what? left. voters. never. show. up.
Since 1992? You mean when Clinton needed to go center to find voters after repeated dem losses?
And since 1992: they’ve had control of all 3 houses for 6 years of the last 32 years. And you’re amazed that they’re forced to reach across the aisle to pass anything?
They lost control in 3 out of 4 elections under Obama.
Exactly. The ones after he’d started governing and running as a moderate rather than a progressive. You’re literally making my point for me.
You mean the thanks that Obama got for the most progressive healthcare reform ever was, drumroll please, losing the house of representatives. AKA. the. left. never. shows. up.
On to the next point. First you say:
There is more than just the presidential election you know
Wow, what a keen insight! I had no idea! 🙄
Then you say:
AKA the left voters never show up [after the first election].
Except the left showed up 4 times for the one president who ran on unapologetically left wing economics from start to finish.
Barely a line apart!
And you wonder why I have to point out there is more than the presidential election! He was president, but he lost congress in 3 of the 4 elections. Obama’s reward for the ACA was the left not showing up to give him congress.
More jabs from you.
Dems have so little control because they compromise and become GOP Lite, which isn’t what voters want.
Again, they go to the center to find votes. When they lose elections, they go to the center to find votes. Because center is worth double and, wait for it, those are the voters that show up.
You want leftists to change this? Then you/leftists have to make sure Dems don’t lose. Because, drumroll please, when they lose they go to the center to find votes.
Dem voters want someone further left
You’re the one that has this backwards. You/they won’t get it when Dems keep losing elections. Because when they lose they go to the center. That’s all there is to it. They aren’t going to court the left voters that never show up. They are going to court the voters that do show up.
Thus what leftists can do: Show up. And vote for Dems.
This is why there are so many of these sayings: You walk before you run. You stick your toes in before you take the plunge. All of those.
Whenever the Dems stick their toes in, they lose. What’s that definition of insanity? Doing the same thing twice and expecting different results. (Except in this case it’s like double insanity, going even further and expecting different results.) The results are: the. left. voters. never. show. up.
That’s not how it works. They aren’t going to go further left when they constantly lose when they go a little bit. That’s why there’s so many of those sayings: Walk before you run, and all those.
Ok gotta speed things up and I’m mostly repeating anyway.
You’re describing maybe .001% of the population there. That’s not what the left is doing.
What the ever loving freak is this? You keep going on about how they just need to run left and they’re going to get all these votes. And then you say there’s no voters there on the left? Are you saying that the centrists are suddenly going to vote for them? They are centrists by definition.
It’s just like above about the presidential and congress elections.
Do you want the Dems to move left?
Obviously. Unlike you.
In conclusion: of the dozens of times that you were dropped on your head as a child, how many would you say were deliberate?
Oh more jabs and insults. That about wraps up the bad faith and insults from you. Again, this is my last reply and your comment is reported.
Jimmy Carter: lost against the aforementioned well-funded and charismatic demagogue. Because he was a well-funded and charismatic demagogue.
You have 0 of 1 right
Bill Clinton: Other way around this time. Bill Clinton was the sax-playing, woman wooing epitome of southern charm.
Plus breaking starting the gradual Dem break up with the labor movement in favor of the 1% and the corporations meant lots of big donations.
Meanwhile, Bush the Elder had the charisma of a damp rag and had broken his signature election promise “read my lips: no new taxes”
0 of 2
Gore: [Won the election](https://theintercept.com/2018/11/10/democrats-should-remember-al-gore-won-florida-in-2000-but-lost-the-presidency-with-a-preemptive-sugoverningf, but the Brooks Brothers Riots and SCOTUS handed it to Dubya, the loser of the election. As a bonus, he made the typical Dem establishment error of capitulating to the GOP far too easily.
0 of 3. Not doing too hot there, buddy.
Obama: Stuck his head WAY out left in his first campaign, running on left-populist reform of the entire system to the benefit of the little people who had been ignored in favor of the rich and powerful for many decades. Huge landslide victory with historically high voter participation borne by the left as much as black people.
There was nothing vague about his messaging: he was there to reform it all to the left. Until he was sworn in, that is 😮💨
0 of 4. You’re really bad at this.
Hillary: here we go again with your headsticking schtick. She ran on the right wing flank of the Dem party. Especially compared to her Primary opponent Bernie (who pollled much better in the head to heads against Trump btw).That’s not being disputed by anyone but you.
0 out of 5. Man, you SUCK at this! Gonna make it 0 of 6? I bet you are.
Biden: Biden had the good fortune of running against the most unpopular incumbent since right after Gerald Ford pardoned Nixon. Most of the country hated Trump and all Biden had to do was not be Trump. Using exactly that as his main strategy, he eked out a very narrow win that wouldn’t have been possible without the left showing up and voting against Trump rather than for Biden.
And no, he hasn’t been governing from the left! He’s barely even been governing from the left AISLE 🤦
0 out of 6. Congratulations! You’re a colossal idiot and/or delusional! 🥳
Damn, that’s one gigantic strawman! Only ONE US presidential candidate has ever run on an “extreme left” platform and that was the socialist Eugene V. Debs.
Again, categorically false. Apart from Obama, the most successful president in the history of the country was FDR, who was also the most economically left wing one ever.
Yeah sure. The corporatist Dems are gonna go left if we just continue to reward them for being center-right to right wing 🙄
No. Win or lose, they’ll always go to the right. Since 1992 their main focus has consistently been almost-republican “swing voters”.
Even as the GOP have drifted further and further right to the point that they’re now a literal fascist party, the DNC have been dogging their heels, picking up crumbs at the left flank of the GOP while leaving behind entire loaves at their own in their quest for this ever-shrinking “moderate Republican” demographic.
Exactly. The ones after he’d started governing and running as a moderate rather than a progressive. You’re literally making my point for me.
Wow, what a keen insight! I had no idea! 🙄
The left didn’t abandon Obama. He abandoned the left long before the mid term elections. He filed the divorce papers and then the DNC was shocked that the invitation for a second honeymoon was rejected.
Except the left showed up 4 times for the one president who ran on unapologetically left wing economics from start to finish.
You’re acting like the left not rewarding the leadership for breaking with them is the fault of the voters, not the people whose job it is to earn votes. That’s victim blaming and also a fundamental misunderstanding of how politics works.
Nope, you’re spewing falsehoods and misunderstandings to me. I don’t know how much is deliberate disinformation, but you’re not informing, you’re misinforming.
Why do you keep repeating that obvious lie? You’re not giving advice. You’re spewing falsehoods and misunderstandings.
You’ve got the causality backwards there, bub. Dems have so little control because they compromise and become GOP Lite, which isn’t what voters want.
Dem voters want someone further left and GOP voters want FULLY fascist candidates. This inbetween bullshit is costing them SO many elections that should have been easily winnable and would have been if they hadn’t run as pro-choice Republicans.
They wouldn’t if they stopped running to the right of the majority of their prospective voters.
Not at all, no. The DNC is a for-profit private corporation masquerading as a nonprofit public party. They’re in it for the money and it’s more profitable to do what the richest 10% want than listening to the other 90%.
Got it backwards again. If Dems want overwhelming and consistent victories, they’re going to have to take a left turn on almost all policy positions to meet tye public where they am instead of demanding that the public reward them for being awful but less awful than the alternative.
Which makes sense since 44 years ago was when they stopped being a center left bordering on social democratic party and started being a center right to right wing neoliberal party.
He did win.. If he hadn’t immediately conceded, a lot of things WOULD be better though, yes.
On the other hand, things would have been MUCH further left if Hillary hadn’t been the nominee. Or if she hadn’t elevated Trump and had instead lost to Jeb or someone like that.
You’re describing maybe .001% of the population there. That’s not what the left is doing.
Again, no. You don’t make people stop being awful by rewarding them for it
Every time they lose it’s because they went to the right wing area they call the center.
Except that there’s no way that anyone who’s on the fence about TRUMP would ever vote for a Democrat. They’ve been convinced that Democrats are all evil. Otherwise they wouldn’t consider an outright fascist who says that Dems are trying to kill everyone.
Obviously. Unlike you.
Again, already am.
Other way around: they lose because they keep going further and further right, alienating their own base and especially young voters. If the Dems cared more about winning and losing than they do about big donations, they would have moved left and started consistently winning DECADES ago.
In conclusion: of the dozens of times that you were dropped on your head as a child, how many would you say were deliberate?
Ah I skimmed through and see your jabs and insults. There’s no good faith discussion when you rely on this, so we’ll see what I respond to (and this will be my last reply, after I report your comment).
Jimmy Carter didn’t just lose, he was unceremoniously punted the fuck out. That’s the left voters not showing up.
Bill Clinton. What are you even suggesting? Charisma? He won because he went to the center. Many people here say he went right past center and went to the right. That’s what he had to do to find votes.
Oh we had President Gore? You can talk about courts all day, we did not have President Gore. Thanks protest 3rd party voters!
Oh you do another jab.
Obama was broad “hope”, thinking that was enough after the wars. And after those wars that was all was necessary. And what did his first 2 years of ACA get him? Voters that didn’t show up for his years 3-8. AKA left voters didn’t show up.
Oh you do another jab.
Hilary after seeing voters not show up for Obama’s years 3-8 stuck her head a little left on the one issue that supposedly matters to logical leftists: Climate Change. And guess what: The. Left. Voters. Did. Not. Show. Up.
And a big jab. Yeah this will be my last reply when you act like that.
Biden, like i said when you run against an incumbent you run center. If he ran left, who know what would have happened.
Oh yeah no subtleness there, you just go for insults. Definitely report and last reply. No logical discourse is possible. I’ll hurry this up and skip over the rest of your insults and whatever else.
I can say it again, they go center because they keep losing. They’ve lost 20 of the last 24 years. So they go to the center to find votes. Because guess what? left. voters. never. show. up.
Since 1992? You mean when Clinton needed to go center to find voters after repeated dem losses?
And since 1992: they’ve had control of all 3 houses for 6 years of the last 32 years. And you’re amazed that they’re forced to reach across the aisle to pass anything?
You mean the thanks that Obama got for the most progressive healthcare reform ever was, drumroll please, losing the house of representatives. AKA. the. left. never. shows. up.
On to the next point. First you say:
Then you say:
Barely a line apart!
And you wonder why I have to point out there is more than the presidential election! He was president, but he lost congress in 3 of the 4 elections. Obama’s reward for the ACA was the left not showing up to give him congress.
More jabs from you.
Again, they go to the center to find votes. When they lose elections, they go to the center to find votes. Because center is worth double and, wait for it, those are the voters that show up.
You want leftists to change this? Then you/leftists have to make sure Dems don’t lose. Because, drumroll please, when they lose they go to the center to find votes.
You’re the one that has this backwards. You/they won’t get it when Dems keep losing elections. Because when they lose they go to the center. That’s all there is to it. They aren’t going to court the left voters that never show up. They are going to court the voters that do show up.
Thus what leftists can do: Show up. And vote for Dems.
This is why there are so many of these sayings: You walk before you run. You stick your toes in before you take the plunge. All of those.
Whenever the Dems stick their toes in, they lose. What’s that definition of insanity? Doing the same thing twice and expecting different results. (Except in this case it’s like double insanity, going even further and expecting different results.) The results are: the. left. voters. never. show. up.
That’s not how it works. They aren’t going to go further left when they constantly lose when they go a little bit. That’s why there’s so many of those sayings: Walk before you run, and all those.
Ok gotta speed things up and I’m mostly repeating anyway.
What the ever loving freak is this? You keep going on about how they just need to run left and they’re going to get all these votes. And then you say there’s no voters there on the left? Are you saying that the centrists are suddenly going to vote for them? They are centrists by definition.
It’s just like above about the presidential and congress elections.
Oh more jabs and insults. That about wraps up the bad faith and insults from you. Again, this is my last reply and your comment is reported.