Liberalism was radical in the era of divine right and absolute rule. The American and French Revolutions were radical liberalism.
In the modern era, defining left as socialist and right as capitalist, only liberals think they’re a center position, but they also don’t know what the hell liberalism is. There are indeed centrist liberals, but the name for them is social democrats.
If you want to make a political axis incredibly reductive and to define right wing as bigotry and left wing as non-bigotry you can call modern liberals centrists I suppose, but then you’re still left with them being right wing for most of these 400 years.
You’re complaining about making the political axis reductive and yet your entire comment completely ignores the existence of actual French leftists during the revolution. The Liberals in France might have helped to begin the revolution, and they were certainly the ones that help to end the revolution, but they weren’t the only members of the revolution. They helped to murder and destroy the French left During the Revolution and in the years that came after. Surely you aren’t arguing that Babeuf was a liberal? But his mere existence shows the great flaw in your theory. The French liberals were to the right of him and a number of other French revolutionaries. So how could they be the extreme radicals you claim they were?
You can only say that Liberals are the left if you’re looking at it solely from the perspective of extreme conservatives and regressives. Yes if that’s the only way you view history is through their eyes then everything can look leftist. That does not mean it is though. The Liberals of the American and French Revolution were those that that wished for the culmination and empowerment the burgiose. The ascendancy of the capitalist class. Nobody who works for this ascendancy can be called leftist. You’re basically making the Overton window argument. That because we are at a time of extreme right wing thought that centrism would have been only moderately right wing. We know that’s not true. Just look at the Shakers in England during their Civil War. A people most would classify as a Proto communist movement.
The concept of Centrism that modern Centrists jerk themselves to sleep over is the idea of “hearing both sides” of an argument and establishing a compromise position.
I’m curious who you think Robespierre was compromising with.
No they aren’t, and no they weren’t.
Liberalism was radical in the era of divine right and absolute rule. The American and French Revolutions were radical liberalism.
In the modern era, defining left as socialist and right as capitalist, only liberals think they’re a center position, but they also don’t know what the hell liberalism is. There are indeed centrist liberals, but the name for them is social democrats.
If you want to make a political axis incredibly reductive and to define right wing as bigotry and left wing as non-bigotry you can call modern liberals centrists I suppose, but then you’re still left with them being right wing for most of these 400 years.
You’re complaining about making the political axis reductive and yet your entire comment completely ignores the existence of actual French leftists during the revolution. The Liberals in France might have helped to begin the revolution, and they were certainly the ones that help to end the revolution, but they weren’t the only members of the revolution. They helped to murder and destroy the French left During the Revolution and in the years that came after. Surely you aren’t arguing that Babeuf was a liberal? But his mere existence shows the great flaw in your theory. The French liberals were to the right of him and a number of other French revolutionaries. So how could they be the extreme radicals you claim they were?
You can only say that Liberals are the left if you’re looking at it solely from the perspective of extreme conservatives and regressives. Yes if that’s the only way you view history is through their eyes then everything can look leftist. That does not mean it is though. The Liberals of the American and French Revolution were those that that wished for the culmination and empowerment the burgiose. The ascendancy of the capitalist class. Nobody who works for this ascendancy can be called leftist. You’re basically making the Overton window argument. That because we are at a time of extreme right wing thought that centrism would have been only moderately right wing. We know that’s not true. Just look at the Shakers in England during their Civil War. A people most would classify as a Proto communist movement.
The concept of Centrism that modern Centrists jerk themselves to sleep over is the idea of “hearing both sides” of an argument and establishing a compromise position.
I’m curious who you think Robespierre was compromising with.