Because your knowledge that certain drugs are bad is not stronger than the urge to conform. If your friends are doing it and you’re the only one not doing it, you’ll feel the urge to join them. Some people can resist that, a lot of people can’t.
And then when they try it, it feels really fuckin good, especially the first time. So good it’s life-changing, you might say.
This is the kind of thing said by someone who has never spent any amount of mental energy trying to understand drugs and drug use in any way. This is not a thought someone develops organically through experimentation and reasoning. This is a line parroted by idiots and it’s the kind of thinking that criminalizes and stigmatizes drug use and gets millions of people killed.
it’s 4chan. they have PhDs in trolling
It’s not trolling it’s ignorance and stupidity.
There’s a difference?
Drug use is bad for health and absolutely does have the potential to spiral into a destructive addiction. Alcohol is a drug, by the way.
With that said, criminalizing drug use barely helps anyone - but the distribution must remain illegal.
The fact that you say “drug use” as a blanket statement proves that you don’t know what you’re on about. There are a lot of drugs with a lot of effects, and even most controlled substances have approved medical applications (opiates for example).
You should look at drug scheduling in the US, which mostly captures if drugs have a medical application.
On a personal note, I hope you never have to face the kind of pain that makes you consider legal or illegal drugs as an outlet.
distribution must remain illegal.
The cost of criminalization consistently outweighs the benefit, particularly when criminalization is paired with a dysfunctional criminal justice and incarceration system.
Courts disproportionately punish the young, poor, and colored, which is why you’ll never see a Sackler behind bars. Prisons harden younger people into more professional and organized crooks while they break older people and rapidly transform them into invalids. And criminalization of distribution without curtailing consumption just drives up prices and encourages cartelization and police corruption.
Sheriff’s gangs in California and Texas work hand in glove with the military police in Mexico and the CIA/DEA to transport protected cargo over the border, fattening everyone’s wallets under the pretext of drug prevention.
Sounds like more of a criminal justice issue than anything. It’s important enough to work on it instead of admitting defeat.
No one is admitting defeat, they are just telling you to stop focusing in on the symptoms and start focusing in the problem. You want to address drug misuse problems in western society? Start by addressing the problems that actually highly correlated with it. Help for unhoused persons. Better mental health systems. Those two things alone could curb a huge majority of drug misuse. If you take care of the symptoms then the problem will be mostly solved without need for any criminalization, be it criminalizing supply or demand. For the rest of people I think more funding of rehabilitation and drug education (and no, just telling people to abstain from drugs is not good education, just like abstinence is not good sex education).
Making distribution illegal just leads to people getting a bad supply that leads to overdoses and poisoning.
You are acting like a helicopter parent. Stop it. People have the right to make decisions about their own bodies and health.
Also you really want to ban all recreational drugs? Congrats you just removed one of people’s only outlets and caused more suicide, self-harm, and mental health issues.
Furthermore not even all drugs are addictive. Classical psychedelics actually are used to cure addictions, it’s highly unlikely you become addicted to one. It’s also one of the least dangerous forms of addiction you can have, and is better than whatever other addiction you would develop instead of if it weren’t there.
People have right to make decisions about their own bodies and health
Drugs are one of people’s only outlets
Don’t you see the issue on the intersection of these two points? People usually don’t make a free choice to go for drugs, they do it to make their life feel more bearable.
Solution? Don’t rally for drugs, rally for improving life conditions so that people wouldn’t try to escape reality.
Why not both?
If we legalize recreational drugs (start w/ weed and shrooms, expand later), here’s what we get:
- consistent dosage, so far fewer ODs and no risk of laced drugs
- history of purchases, so warning signs if pattern of use changes
- ability to tax in order to fund rehab programs
- ability to refuse service and call for professional help if someone is displaying warning signs
- fewer cartels, because why would you risk buying illegally if you can get it legally at a store?
Banning it just pushes the sale and distribution underground. I honestly don’t see the benefits there, especially for the less harmful drugs.
We should also be rallying to improve living conditions. Banning drugs doesn’t help anyone but the cartels.
Not really plenty of people take up drugs for fun rather than as a coping mechanism. A lot is just because of curiosity too. The motives are diverse.
Solution? Don’t rally for drugs, rally for improving life conditions so that people wouldn’t try to escape reality.
That doesn’t remove the other, more sensible reasons people do drugs. See above statement.
It’s not always possible to improve the quality of life. We should definitely try though, don’t get me wrong. There will always be heartache, sorrow, mental health issues and disabilities though. That’s just the human condition. Sometimes drugs are actually the less self destructive coping mechanism, especially with psychedelics. In some cases something that’s recreational for one person, is a medicine for a second person, and an addiction for a third. See amphetamine/adderall for an example.
Half this country wants the other half to hurt because fox news said they should. Your last sentence is literally impossible.
More like a third, but a third of people are dumbasses and don’t vote.
I’m overweight… I guess that means sugar destroys people’s lives. Why haven’t they banned sugar?
$
The UK taxed sugar (to try and curb soft drink consumption, thanks Jamie Oliver) and it just resulted in the non-diet/zero versions of everything containing both sugar AND sweetners. They managed to stay the same price and now all taste like shite, but I guess it’s cheaper for the poor corporations who had to comply (by changing their drinks entirely rather than paying the tax).
But… most places have banned these drugs. I’m not following your logic. Are you saying they should be legal because we’re free to ruin our health in other ways?
I’m an advocate of actual freedom and personal choice. Meth is obviously a downward spiral for most. However, the issue is most drugs don’t start out that way. My point is that criminalizing drugs is the wrong approach. That is all.
Drugs feel amazing. Getting high is like the fucking grand canyon, one of the things in life that lives up to the hype. Doing drugs makes you happier than you thought you could be, and there are a lot of people who don’t have a lot of reasons to be happy.
We shouldn’t pretend that drugs are bad, mm-kay. Drugs are awesome. That’s the problem. They’re too awesome. It’s an awesome overload, and you end up not wanting to do anything except for drugs.
People who do drugs are not evil. They’re having fun, experiencing new things, making friends and bonding over shared experiences. You tell a bunch of kids that drugs will ruin their lives, and then somebody at a party passes them a joint or offers them a bump of coke, they’re going to realize you were full of shit.
Like, let’s say that there was some weird flesh-eating bacteria that was specifically found only on water slides, but only on a few water slides. Now it’s your job to convince all the children of the world to avoid water slides, because of the small possibility of bacteria. It’s a serious problem, and it would be correct to tell everyone to avoid all waterslides everywhere, even if only a small percentage of waterslide riders died horrible deaths. So you tell people waterslides might kill you or maim you in excruciating ways. But if you act like waterslides aren’t fun, you lose all credibility. Most people who ride the waterslides don’t die, and they go on to tell everyone how much fun they had on waterslides, and that doesn’t make them bad people.
Would it not make them bad people if waterslides were that dangerous? They wouldn’t be lying, but they would be encouraging people to endanger themselves.
If there are even a few water slides that dangerous, then all water slides are potentially dangerous.
This is the literal actual real world thing right now. Despite the few waterslides that are dangerous, there are plenty of actual waterslides in operation.
So, demonizing drugs is actually a bad idea, and this thread continues to prove it.
I have no words almost…
But your little declaration somehow perversly juxtapositions the odd 100 000 deaths from drug overdoses in the US alone last year.
Are you offended by this? Seriously asking?
Yes, since it’s such an awfully negligent way of thinking.
I’d worry some poor young soul listening to the type of ‘adult individual’, falling into a fentanyl addiction, for example, thinking it ‘fun and safe’ forever ruining their life.
I think this person probably was referring to lesser drugs such as cannabis or cocaine. Lumping them all together is the problem.
Found the druggie
Found the guy that skim reads a comment and then draws a silly conclusion.
It’s a troll account.
I read & deeply comprehended the whole entire thing. It was excellently written and insightful and I am sincerely happy for people who can enjoy drugs responsibly and it does not interfere with their productive lives,
I have friends who enjoy mushrooms and LSD and alcohol and cigarettes and cocaine and abusing things like Adderall and Vyvanse and they all seem a hell of a lot happier than I am, but I just don’t want anything to do with it because
take my perspective for what it’s worth, I am a complete teetotaler, the only thing I put in my mouth or my body are nutritious foods, water, and prescription medication. In my childhood the fear of death was put into me regarding drugs, and my dad was an alcoholic and then he turned to cocaine and it all freaked me out, the way cocaine changed my dad was terrifying and has left me forever unstable, and I listened to Nancy Reagan when she said “say no to drugs” and I am permanently in that mindset, for better or for worse.
This is the comment that you should have written, not a silly meme comment.
It is about distinguishing addictive and damaging drugs from useful medicines with a low chance of addiction. You are not going to convince me that the majority of people that have used meth or crack are fine. Where as weed or lsd I would.
Yea, plus many people addicted to that shit end up doing bad things, Rob, steal, sell to kids, etc.
That’s the same with heroin. At some point you’re addicted as hell and have no money left, so what do you do to get that relief from it again? Prostitute yourself, steal stuff and sell it, rob someone. This is literally an endless cycle. You become more addicted so you have to make more money. Since drug addiction imposes a high risk of losing your job and house you have to become somewhat criminal. The only ways out of this are either 1:dying from the drugs, 2: being able to get off of them(what often is literally impossible without help and even if you manage it without a stable living situation(house, job which both are hard to find as an ex drug addicted homeless person) its not unlikely that you start using them again) or 3: finding a place where you can get them for free. One of these places exists in Berlin where heroin addicted can get free medical grade heroin for free.
Someone’s, but not all of them.
And generally, addiction is other issues that we as a society could help with before it becomes those issues.
Tried meth once. Felt like Adderall. I could see why people abuse it, but I didn’t feel the need.
Because ADHD stimulants are forms of methamphetamines.
The umbrella term is amphetamines. And not all ADHD stimulants are amphetamines, as there’s also methylphenidate (ritalin) which is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor kinda like cocaine, except for majority of people a lot less enjoyable.
That’s cause Adderall is meth.
Or meth adjacent. I don’t know the chemistry.
No it’s fucking not.
And this kind of thinking is why the local cops raided a clinic my town and why doctors in my town are now scared to prescribe it.
This is what happens when people stigmatize and demonize legal meds that actually help folks who genuinely need it.
nah, you’re the wrong here buddy
I take it myself and have done so for 10+ years, and know the chemistry of it. It’s in the same tree, but it’s absolutely not meth.
If it were meth, it’d be call meth.
Adderall is not meth, but it’s still a form of speed/amphetamine and is still addictive to some neurotypical people. Maybe not as addictive or dangerous, but very much in the same category.
The reason ADHD people don’t get addicted is because of their altered neurology and the doses it’s prescribed at.
In fact actual meth is sometimes prescribed to ADHD patients in small doses. It’s called Desoxyn.
Cops raided a pharmacy because they needed a fix. Foia the body cam footage if they got them.
If we’re just assuming stuff based on vibes then caffeine is meth too.
Yep. I had an Adderall Rx for years prior, felt almost identical. But I also swallowed it, didn’t smoke or inject it.
Adderall is amphetamine, the base compound.
Meth is methamphetamine, amphetamine with a methyl group attached to it, so it’s very closely related to Adderall. That small change makes it a bit more potent, longer lasting and euphoric though.
But meth can also get prescribed for ADHD and narcolepsia (under the brand name ‘Desoxyn’) in very rare cases where even Adderall doesn’t seem to do the trick. So basically, both substances can be used therapeutically and they both can fuck up your life if you start abusing them, with meth admittedly being more potent and dangerous than regular amphetamine.
While there is some credence to this example, we all know chemistry does not work like this. For example, H2O, very good, essential for all life. H2O2, not so much.
I will!
The majority of people that have used meth or crack are fine.
Now, don’t get me wrong: meth is fantastically addictive. It’s the most physically addictive drug there is, as far as I’m aware. And the fantastically high addiction rate for first-time users of meth is: roughly 30%.
70% of people who try the most addictive drug in the world don’t get addicted, and go on to do other things like play tennis or do their taxes or switch to weed instead.
I am not just talking about addiction, I am also referring to the physiological damage it does.
While it’s possible to cause significant damage from a single overdose I don’t think it is likely from trying something at a sensible dose once. Most of the time the damage addicts have is done through repeated heavy use.
Also, afaik, alot of the damage done by things like meth and heroin are side effects. Like meth gives you psychosis and brain damage from staying up for days and not eating any food. The long term effects of meth, like a rotting mouth and permanent chemical imbalances can take years to manifest. If you want an example see people who take Adderall for years. Heroin similarly stops you from getting proper nutrition because all you want is heroin and it can give you brain damage from a lack of oxygen, which is a side effect of getting really close to overdosing.
As you’ve said, most people (at the very worst a whopping 70%) try these drugs and continue with their life without getting addicted. It’s very dangerous to stigmatize them cause all it does is make people afraid of getting treatment.
Trying drugs once rarely does any psychological or physiological damage after one or even a few uses.
There are few cases where taking certain drugs will trigger the start of people already prone to things like schizophrenia… But it takes a while for legit psychological and physical addiction with few exceptions. Even with the most addictive drugs there are.
He right I ded a mef ones time only and my brain brokeded
a more accurate analogy would be toxic chemicals in the waterslides that build up in the body, that takes a while to be expelled out
It’s more complex than this even. Not all drugs are that toxic. In fact some of the most addictive aren’t even that toxic at all like heroin. It’s things like addiction, overdose, lack of clean supply, and the side effects that make it dangerous.
Even ones that are destructive to the body aren’t always because of the chemicals they leave behind. Take meth for example: it’s bad because of how much strain and immediate damage it causes, not long lived toxins. In small doses it’s reasonably okay and is even prescribed by doctors sometimes. At amounts addicts do with the regularity they do them the damage builds up faster than it can be repaired by the body. MDMA, Amphetamine, Ketamine, and cocaine are similar here I believe.
Disclaimer: I am not a doctor, I mainly know about drugs from doing them and researching them online.
Feels like a kurzgesagt summary to me
They did a piece on nicotine a while back that opened with how amazing it is followed by how it fucks up your body over time.
Fantastic analogy and a good read. I’ve had a lot of experience with these bad drugs at various points in my life and I regret none of it.
Arrogance, social pressure, and sometimes just plain low IQ.
That is indeed a description for those that widespread demonise drug users.
I suppose there is also slow suicide and self medication.
To be fair to anon, they’re asking sincerely if you take them at face value. A lot of people just don’t know why others just fall down that rabbit hole.
I’ve known people who have been addicted to some kind of street narcotic. They stopped when they got away from their bad relationship and improved their life.
It’s not about what will happen later, it’s about dealing with what is here and now, it’s a form of escapism. Not every case, mind you, but many.
Life sucks, and if you have/know/love people, and get the same in return, it sucks less. There’s a reason to keep going. People who end up addicted to harmful, hard, narcotics and other street drugs are generally in situations that they don’t know how to handle and just want to not feel the way they do now. Sometimes what they’re feeling is depression and hopelessness, or something similar. Imagine going from worried about everything, stressed out of your mind, depressed and suicidal, to complete careless bliss in minutes because you took a drug.
I’m not endorsing drug use, at all. Drugs (specifically street drugs) are not the answer. You’ll feel better while your life implodes and you won’t care that your spouse left or that you just lost your house, job and friends, because you’re so high that you can’t feel the sadness from these things happening. They’ll make you feel like a winner while you lose everything, and you’ll be blissfully ignorant of the truth. The drugs just fucked your life right up.
Bluntly, people are suffering through so much by the time they turn to drugs that they are looking for any relief for the constant pain and suffering they go through every moment of every day. They need help. They either get it from society/friends/family, or they get it from whatever drug they can score to help them get through it.
They then end up addicted and it begins a cycle of violence that is difficult to stop. They need help, friends, family, understanding, patience and time to get better, and often what they get is demeaned, kicked aside, thrown in jail, abandoned and disowned; all of which makes them go deeper into the gaping black hole of drug use.
I don’t have the answer to fix this situation. I never claimed I did, but I hope that someone reading this understands the psychology of addiction a little better after reading it. I am, by no means, a doctor or specialist. I’ve just observed the recovery first hand, and spoken to people who have gone through it. What I’ve said here is the culmination of the discussions I have had with people who have lived it. I’m certain there are other versions of this kind of story, leading to addiction (and hopefully out of it). My take away is that drugs are not a cause, they’re an effect. The cause is sometimes mental health related, or it could just be shit luck. Either way, you don’t choose to get addicted to drugs, you feel like you need to take drugs to deal with life, and addiction just happens as a consequence of that. I firmly believe in social programs for welfare/income assistance (including UBI), and social programs for drug rehab. All of which should be provided as a societal benefit. If people can get the mental and financial help they need, when they need it, I believe we can prevent a lot of people from turning to drugs to deal with their problems. We can avoid people becoming homeless and incapable of benefiting society. Reducing crime, and reducing suffering universally throughout our society.
I also believe that there’s always going to be “junkie scum” that would rather take UBI to cover the bills while they rot away at home, in what quickly becomes a drug den. I believe the people who are actual junkie scum that would do that while having free access to resources to turn their life around, is pretty small. I think that the vast majority of people want to live a life they can be proud of, and will do so if given the chance.
The core problem is that they’re not given that chance. They go right from being under their parents wing to being thrown face first in the dirt and told to pick themselves up “by their bootstraps” and figure it out, by people who hold more money than they’ll ever earn. We should be ashamed that drug use is as high as it is. To me, it indicates a massive gap in how much we actually care about our fellow humans. That somehow, if they can’t do anything that we find useful, when we find it useful for someone to do that, then they’re not worthy of living. That’s why it’s called “earning” a living, because if you don’t earn it, then you don’t deserve to live. IMO, that’s callous and cruel.
I was tossed to the rigors of society in my late teens, I won’t get into the circumstances, but I narrowly avoided getting into a situation where I would become an addict. I never realized, when I was in that situation, that I was literally a bad payday away from being homeless, jobless, junkie scum. Only for the love and support of a few, did I manage to get through the hardest of times and earn a living. Not everyone is so lucky.
Yeah I’ve come to a lot of those same conclusions. And one thing I’ve struggled to convince people of is that calling addicts scum doesn’t help them quit. Yes they need to want to quit in order to quit, but they need to believe the pain of quitting will be worth it and that they deserve to be sober. I’ve never heard of someone hating themselves and being so ostracized they get sober. It’s when they find something or someone worth quitting for or decide they deserve to turn their life around.
I had the happy experience of being someone’s reason to quit.
I didn’t know that was happening at the time, they told me afterwards, but it was a nice thing to find out.
That was awesome to read. I loved your perspective and compassion!
I’m not American, but you’d you’d make a great president, right now…
Thanks, however, I cannot be president.
I was not born in the USA, nor do I even live there. I’m Canadian and our politics and country overall is heavily influenced by what’s going on in America, so I tend to have relevant opinions on all sorts of issues that affect both countries.
I agree with everything except for when you say that you’ll feel like a winner while you loose everything. You actually know just how fucked up everything is and you feel like a fucking loser piece of shit but you can’t stop. You don’t feel like a winner. You feel like you’re losing everything and it’s extremely painful and you feel like you can’t do anything to stop it. The drugs barely make it any better eventually and then you’ve even lost that.
Nice try DEA
It’s that good huh?
not really. first time, maybe. but it’s the law of diminishing returns.
wanna get shit done… sure. want to stay awake for days on end, fun the first time maybe.
want to not be able to function without it? naw, not as fun
Op has never felt so desperate to feel anything else
Hey now, some of us can handle our drugs just fine. Don’t judge the entire world because a fraction can’t tell themselves no.
some of us can handle our drugs just fine
This attitude is what gets many people addicted to dangerous drugs. “I’m different, I can control it”. I’ve seen it a few times around me.
Well, I seem to be doing fine. In fact my life by all metrics right now is better than it’s ever been.
It is true that many drug users never actually get their lives ruined over it.
But drugs are still negatively impacting their health, and there is always a risk of addiction forming and getting out of control.
I live in a country where drugs are illegal, but alcohol is “alright”. Should I say people fuck up their health big time, and many, especially among men, do face issues with alcohol addiction? And those that go for drugs anyway rarely actually recover?
My take: people don’t need drugs. People need an improvement in material and mental wellbeing, and drugs (and alcohol) are there as a form of escaping a poor reality. Drugs are just the way to make the world more bearable and “fun”, to try to squeeze happiness from a grim reality, without thinking much of what it costs in the long run.
very much doubt that it’s a “fraction”
Here there’s roughly 200,000 people who use amphetamines recretionally and about 20,000 people who according to doctors have a problem with their usage. I.e. 90% can use them occasionally without an issue. For alcohol the number here is closer to 85%.
“Don’t do drugs” Hot take.
Apparently it is a hot take nowadays.
Guys, drugs are dangerous, unhealthy and you may not be able to recognize deep addiction and stop when you absolutely should.
That’s it. There are better ways to have fun, I promise.
Say perhaps to drugs
So this machine is at high speeds and is incredibly dangerous and if it crashes while you are in it or riding it you’ll probably die.
Why are people using cars and motorcycles? I don’t get it!
Not a great analogy honestly, you can drive a car your whole life and your odds of dying in a car accident are probably like 1%. Meanwhile your odds of dying, or at the very least having very serious health effects, from using hard drugs your whole life are basically guaranteed.
It isn’t guaranteed. Like that old lady that became 120 years old smoking a pack a day.
me neither, but probably because public transport is expensive and not at all optimised
No-one wakes up and decides that they’re going to get addicted to drugs today. Your life has typically been in a real shit place for a long time and it’s a “fuck it” type situation.
You don’t usually see happy and wealthy people getting addicted to crack.
You don’t usually see happy and wealthy people getting addicted to crack.
Cocaine though. Same drug, different package
Yup. Wealthy people do get addicted to drugs like cocaine, they just often have enough wealth to either still die wealthy or last long enough to get rehab.
You don’t have to be depressed to use drugs, just curious and looking for more life experiences.
For some people, they see being addicted to drugs as an improvement on their current situation.
Life is already fucked, might as well get a buzz while I’m doing it.
If your reasoning is my life is bad may as well take a short term high for long term low. Then it’s no surprise your life is shit. A normal person thinks OK my life is pretty bad let’s not make it worse.
Sounds like someone who hasn’t experienced that low
It doesn’t matter because it will never be a reasonable choice. You can believe that they made a reasonable choice to get addicted if that makes you feel better.
I’m glad you can’t think of a life so bad.
Indeed. If drugs are the only thing that can make you feel good, it can feel stupid not to use them.
My experiences being around people with cocaine have been at two opposite spectrums: people with shit lives that want a release, and people with families/wealth/opportunities that want a release.
The latter experience for me was an office Christmas party. We shared an office with a law firm, and one guy with a wife, two kids, and what I’d assume is a solid six-figure salary had two keys worth, several joints, several beers, and whatever he was smoking from a pipe in the toilets.
It might not be an addiction, but it’s definitely used by wealthy people. Hell, if the rumours about Musk are true, the dude is on all sorts of illegal shit all the time…
His shit isn’t illegal. He has his doctor prescribe whatever high quality shit he wants. It’s only illegal when YOU do it.
Nah, pretty sure there’s no prescription for meth or cocaine.
There certainly is for meth (for treatment-resistant ADHD), but iirc cocaine’s only medical use is during certain dental procedures, it’s not something you can be prescribed to take home
Huh, I thought only other amphetamines like Adderal were available for prescription. TIL.
It is very rarely prescribed, basically only if ritalin and a high dose of Adderall both fail to help.
Or if you’re rich and have a doctor who will prescribe whatever you want, presumably
I knew at least one kid in high school who was told that weed was as bad as heroin. Then he saw his friends doing weed and everything seemed fine. So then he did weed and everything seemed fine. Then he started asking about heroin.
this is the problem with bullshitting around prohibition. if you feel like people lied to you about weed, they could have been wrong about heroin too.
“What’s that old saying? ‘Beer before liquor, never sicker… Don’t do heroin.,’” -Bojack Horseman
What?. Explain celebrities overdosing then
not all of them are happy
Is it possible to get second hand high from those ?
don’t think so. either way don’t try it. tastes like burnt plastic and not worth ruining your life over
