it’s giving Zoë Roth
Just a side note, just because the United States fought a war that most people think it was about slavery. It was not. The North profited off of slavery. This was all to consolidate power and build up the federal government, which nowadays is constantly overreaching into our lives. Also, it is very concerning given the divisive climate in our country and the accelerating powers of the executive branch with the erosion of checks and balances that possibly we are on the verge of another Civil War. It could be thought that given the rate of incarceration, we just don’t see the human suffering like we did back then. Maybe nothing’s really changed. And maybe white people, the poor whites are all a part of this system too. I mean, look around America. What do we have, but cheeseburger stands. And five lane highways going through our neighborhoods with monster trucks running over kids. I mean, in a very short period of time, I’ve had three incidents where I have been around firearms that put me in danger. Slavery was an inefficient, outdated system of Managing Society. The same powers that justified slavery are the same powers both left and right that run the country in the United States. Have y’all heard of a Dixie Democrat? For there is no war but the class war. I am a cracker, but there are black people that have the same opinion as me. And I get a lot of my theories based upon their opinions. No war but the class war libturds
You and others try desperately to bend and twist history to be something different than it was. It’s pretty simple: the Civil War started because the South seceded, and the North said “No.”
So the question is only why the South seceded. And I guess we can never know for certain, because it’s not like we can get a prioritized list of reasons for secession from each state that seceded OH WAIT YES WE CAN.
Each state listed their causes for secession, and primary amongst their concerns was slavery, whether is was concern for Northerners eventually getting rid of slavery, or upset that slaves escaping to the North were not being returned, or even that some Northern states were abolishing slavery within their states.
Yes, some Northern states still benefitted from slavery at the time, and yes, Lincoln was prepared to grant slavery in perpetuity to the slave-holding states, so it’s clear that the Northern states were not fighting to end slavery. However, that doesn’t change the main two things that led to the Civil War:
-
The Southern states seceded to preserve slavery.
-
The Northern states said “No.”
-
The rest of your comment is just arguing against points no one made.
hurr durr racism doesn’t exist y’all
Opinions promptly ignored.
That’s lowkey awesome
Why do so many people talk like this post is about whether or not you should burn these down or not? Or how they should be maintained?
Girls saw the burning plantation and took a selfie for the symbolic value of it. I don’t see them argue that people should destroy the historical evidence, or anything. They just took a strong symbolic Image and if you don’t like the symbolism in it, you are a weirdo.
Can we just appreciate their picture? Think about its symbolism?
And maybe then we can have the discussion about what to do with these things. People with no knowledge could start with listening. And if needed, they can add their perspective afterwards.
This is so incredibly stupid. We might aswell cripple most of the food production and burn down entire cities since most of the America and farms used to have some form of slavery or racism. Was that building still used for slavery, or did they just attack innoncent people and damaged their own food supply?
Now this photo is culturally significant! 🤗
This building had to be destroyed for the photo to exist and become culturally significant, just as the lives and culture of the planter’s slaves had to be destroyed for the building to exist and become culturally significant. Poetic, isn’t it?
Sorry man you don’t know shit
Good and well thought out argument, your comment definitely made me support burnings of historical places. I had to check if Im on reddit
If it was a museum about the horrors of slavery you’d have a point, the problem is this was a resort. They were still literally profiting off of slavery…
Wait till you learn about half of the hotel resort histories. Many of them use castles and palaces that were just as mean towards slaves.
Transforming something with bad history into a hotel or resort is something that happens all the time, everywhere.
I mean, there is literally haunted hotels tourism, and those buildings have commonly seen some really dark stuff.
In my country, there is a prison hotel where I can spend a night in a building where my kind used to be… well, it’s history, so people like visiting those places, including me.
Should we burn them all?
IDK maybe? Are the people and political structures that committed those horrors still in power?
What? No, lol. I mean, modern slavery is a thing, but it’s not really a race thing anymore, neither it’s done by the government, but human trafficking and exploitation in general by criminal groups.
It’s absolutely done by the government via prison labor and it’s absolutely still a race thing.
https://www.epi.org/publication/rooted-racism-prison-labor/
Its as if auswitch administrative building was preserved in its peak state, had all its history scrubbed and added an option to host weddings with era approperiate costumes since the people weren’t actually gassed there.
It wasn’t a museom, it was whitewashing slavery.
And besides this is america. There are business signs in europe older than that building.
Using historical objects where peasants were banned from, to now allowing those that were banned to explore and utilize said objects freely? The horror. What do you think happens in every historical castle around the world? Should Chinese burn down forbidden city? The building isn’t even owned by the same family anymore, but some attorney and was added to historical buildings registry. The owner already said he hopes to rebuild it as it was both a reminder of brutal history of chattel slavery and economical drive (tourism) to the region.
Good job fighting the history, you really showed them, I’m sure the people in graves feel very insulted.
Are you under the impression that the girls in the photo burned down the plantation, or are you unaware of the history of such buildings in this nation, what they symbolize, and why the descendants of those brutalized in the shadow of those white pillars might be happy to see it burned down?
Nobody went and burned down the plantation because of its history. (Unless this turns out to be arson, which I would find entirely justifiable.)
The plantation burned down, and some folks are rightly rejoicing in the destruction of a nexus of brutality and harm.
If rich young descendants of nazis were getting married in auschwitz on the regular, I think that wouldn’t sit well with some folks, so I’m certainly not going to shed any tears about all the rich young white women who will have to find a better place to serve as the backdrop of their weddings.
Or is that that you don’t know what “early” means in this context? It would have been even more satisfying if it had waited a couple of weeks to burn down.
Note that I’m not from US so might be missing more context
This was a great film, and might lend some needed perspective.
I mean, if millions of people were killed as part of genocide in that building, I’m sure no one would think of hosting events there, but you’re comparing two vastly different things. The abuse that happened in that building is awful, but stop comparing it to genocide you goofball
EDIT: And no, I never said the girls themselves burned it and then took a selfie of the crime lol. I’m talking about people who do not see the problem with burning down historical places and are expressing their will to do it or support towards it.
The abuse that happened in that building is awful, but stop comparing it to genocide you goofball
Yeah, you clearly lack context and understanding (or maybe just empathy for) the brutality and scope of american slavery, and I’ve tried about as much as I am willing to to help you understand. The fact that it was less, uh, concentrated to specific sites makes it no less horrific, and you seem to have some huge misconceptions regarding its scope. Good day to you.
As a german i am rather sure there are enough nutjobs that would like to marry in a historic concentration camp in ss uniforms
Ok. Really happy for you. Or sorry that it happened.
More burnt plantations please! We can put them out with confederate tears.
too late I drunked em’ all 😔
Hear hear, I will drink to that yes sir!
The lead in the paint and who tf knows what else (eg covered up arsenic paint or wallpaper) is in that smoke. Seriously avoid breathing in smoke from home fires, it has unfathomably deadly stuff in it
Generally speaking it’s best to avoid inhaling any smoke be it from a fire or even a cigarette.
Dude a place that old? Prolly has everything in it. Wouldn’t surprise me if a renovation in the 50s gave it some cadmium.
Yeah, fuck the south. Enjoy, ladies.
Hell ya let that thing burn! So happy for the people and the country. They should be proud of themselves.
Ok now that y’all read thus far. Auschwitz, Alcatraz and a myriad insane asylums not burner down for very good reasons. But an old slave plantation and we’re all smiles…
If the German government turned Auschwitz into a hotel and resort for people to throw parties and get married and ignore the atrocities that happened there, I’d be in favor of burning it down
Alcatraz
Considering that this administration is talking about reopening Alcatraz, uh… yeah, probably would have been better for everyone if it burned down.
Because goyim aren’t having weddings at auschwitz. If the plantations were treated as relics of antebellum brutality we wouldn’t celebrate their incineration, but instead they’re romanticized.
That plantation, Nottoway, explicitly presented itself as romantic. When I visited, they had an exhibit about how kindly the old master was, because he gave the slave children candy at Christmas.
It’s a place for rich white people to have weddings at, while being served by underpaid black people who are probably descendants of the people held there. They sold cotton in the gift shop - it was a sugarcane plantation. That’s something you do on fucking purpose.
If you want a place that understands that it is Americans Auschwitz - Whitney Plantation. Amazing place that everyone in the American south should visit.
You can tell what their priorities are because the History section of their webpage had nothing in it but the age of the trees on the property.
Yes - the oak trees were a big deal. Touring the gardens was part of the house tour.
They really try to make one of the daughters of the house a sort of princess/Southern Belle. The woman at the gift shop really encouraged me to pick this up, when we started talking about Gone With the Wind.
I’ll have to flip through the ephemera collection to find some of the other “fun” things. Also got a coffee table book somewhere.
those smiles
those smiles make me smile
Beautiful building, awful history.
Waste of water trying to put it out, unless of course it was endangering nearby structures
Aside from nearby structures, generally you don’t want fire releasing toxins in the atmosphere,even were it just wood. Likely the are plastics, bad paints,and multiple other things we wouldn’t want just burnt willy nilly. Not that I’m against the destruction of the place; fuck that place.
Look at their faces! They know fate took its time granting this justice hundreds of years later … a slow burn.
Daigle wrote. “The loss of Nottoway is not just a loss for Iberville Parish, but for the entire state of Louisiana. It was a cornerstone of our tourism economy and a site of national significance.”
Fuck that guy
I mean I like old houses and would have gone specifically to dunk on some asshole not owning their slave built home.
I don’t like religion but I don’t advocate burning them down either for the same reason.
In Louisiana, they call their counties “parishes.” It has nothing to do with religion lol
I’m aware but if we’re talking about buildings built in the backs of inhumane acts then religion tops all but race and I’m pretty sure there would be a different reaction if it were a church burning down.
Oh I thought you were saying previously that it was burned due to a religious affiliation with the parish, I misunderstood your last sentence
Louisiana’s usage of the term “parish” for a geographic region or local government dates back to the French colonial and Spanish colonial periods and is connected to ecclesiastical parishes.
lol
The origin of the word ‘county’ is:
The term is derived from the Old French comté denoting a jurisdiction under the sovereignty of a count (earl) or, in his stead, a viscount (vicomte).
It no longer has anything to do with feudalism, just like parish has nothing to do with religion anymore.
Yes, it means “geographical region” in this context because we are not in French and Spanish colonial times… It is not religious any more.
Were it an actual museum of sorts, I’d agree. This wasn’t a place people went to learn about the horrors of slavery, it was a fucking resort
It literally was a museum it wasn’t profitable so it was sold and made a resort.
Yeah, visiting that should have been like visiting fucking Auschwitz, not a vacation.
It was at one point. It stopped being a museum because of income issues because people in this country aren’t the “learn your horrible history” type, they’re more the bulldoze and forgot type.
Ahhh that’s why the US is such a shit country. I get it! It’s because of the genocide of the indigenous people. So the entire US is kinda like Auschwitz. It’s just not a place you want to live.
Contrasting the Plantation vs Auschwitz is about a living celebration of evil vs. a living reminder of evil. Which, I mean, I totally get it if you want to paint the whole nation with a brush like that, but I hope you at least apply that logic to all destruction of indigenous peoples and cultures, not just in the US.
The more accessible point to be made in this context is that Mt. Rushmore should be like Auschwitz. Given the nature of the Six Grandfathers and the Black Hills - yeah, absolutely.
And this here is why capitalism is good, it prevents the masses from forcing the horrors of history to be dull and gloomy just because the vast majority of people want it to be.
Oh thank God for the people working to make the horrors of history less horrible
Edit: oh shit, did I eat the onion? Imma feel bad about that downvote if I missed the implied /s
I almost missed it myself, but I’m quite confident it’s peeking out from behind “the vast majority of people want it”
Oh yeah that’s exactly what was happening there.
🤡
Wow, this was the strongest case of Poe’s law I’ve seen in awhile. Well done.
Well, people aren’t specifically advocating for this to be burnt down, they’re just happy to see a remnant of slavery gone away.
You can not advocate for something to happen but be glad it did.
I am specifically advocating for this to be burnt down. These monsters gleefully ignore the torture and murder that went on here when the building was made. Imagine modern Germans throwing parties and getting married at Buchenwald. Imagine if Dachau’s website made no mention of the 40,000+ people murdered there.
Historical sites shouldn’t be preserved just because they’re old. They should be preserved with context, and when the context is taken away, the reason to preserve them is as well.
You can not advocate for something to happen but be glad it did.
Agreed. I never advocated for violence against CEOs, but Luigi has already saved hundreds of lives (United healthcare started approving more claims immediately after BT died) and he revitalized the debate for socialized medicine so I am very glad he did was he did.
And the quoted person wasn’t for advocating or glorifying the history of the house or property and yet somehow you’re ok with insulting them personally.
It should have been bought by the fed and turned into a museum of shit Sherman didn’t burn.
turned into a museum of shit Sherman didn’t burn.
Shame they didn’t do that beforehand, then someone could’ve finished what Sherman started.
If it ruined your families lives you might think differently.
Big jump to assume it hasn’t bud.
Doubt
Bigot.
Having empathy is being a bigot now?
Fuck offNo doubting my race is bigoted so let’s reverse that and you fuck off ya fuckin bigot.
And burning it down means that you’re erasing your history and have zero respect for your family.
Yes, having an emotional stake in an issue can make people think differently, but it doesn’t make any POV objectively right.
Ignoring the context of a situation is completely useless.
So are generalized platitudes. On the flip side somebody might feel “different” about WWII if their sweet, beloved great grandpa was a gestapo officer, but that wouldn’t be a valid reason for anyone to change their opinion.
I personally feel that the historical significance of a thing outweighing its own bloody history, and believe that keeping the thing around helps us to remember its evil history, which may help us prevent it from happening, again.
But, I also appreciate your POV. 🤷♂️
That’s all I said but apparently my skin color isn’t quite right for this tachy fella.
If white rich people are using it as a place to vacation and get married, it’s not a lesson and should burn.
The slave quarters and other structures remain unburned, actually, so in fact the historical landmark/lesson is still there. :)
Ehh we gotta keep a few remnants around. Think, if none of these places existed, you’d get neo-nazis claiming shit like “slavery never existed, there is no evidence of such a thing, where are the buildings? Where are these so called “plantations”. Exactly, it never existed”.
The slave quarters and other structures remain unburned, actually, so in fact the historical landmark/lesson is still there. :)
You’re drawing really strange moral lines here.
As if you aren’t.
How so?
Exactly, erasing these things threatens to erase history. Granted, this is a bad case to defend as a historical landmark of slavery, since it was being used as a venue and resort, and therefore glorifying a southern culture
largelywholly made from the enslavement of Africans.What the fuck? It was being used as a resort? Jesus fucking Christ.
Like the Confederate statues? Nah. Tear it down. It doesn’t serve as a reminder to prevent. It serves as a monolithic idol for shitty people to rally around and mythologize.
I don’t advocate burning history altogether, but keeping shitty places and statues around for shitty people to glorify serves the exact opposite of preserving the history. It just gives them hope and ideas that the “old days” will come back around. Take a picture or something and put it in a museum, at most. And make the museum about the horrific acts and atrocities, not about preserving the history of the vile.
There’s a reason the Vietnam memorial is so iconic. It lists the soldier’s names, and it preserves their legacy as a reminder of pointless war. But it doesn’t glorify the war. Same for the ground zero memorial in NYC. It does not glorify the war in Afghanistan and Iraq, nor the atrocities that occured over there despite the reminder from the Vietnam war. It serves to remind of the lives of many that were taken.
The only reason I’m okay with the preservation of the Holocaust memorial locations is that the history of the people murdered there is on display. The scratches in the walls. Their glasses and belongings. The current political situation aside, people can go there and see the evil that occured as a somber reminder. Whether they are one of the peoples that those atrocities happened to or not.
Yet still, shitty people pose on the tracks for instagram, or go there for the evil itself, rather than that somber reminder.
A slave house, plantation, or Confederate statue isn’t a somber reminder. It’s simply there because they want glorify the shitty acts and want them to come back around. They want to remind people what they think the worth of their existence is. They want to deify their generals and create some type of mythology to their history. There’s nothing there for the people who were abused or murdered in those times. It only stands currently so people now can say they want to preserve “the history,” which is the history of the abusers and the murderers.
If something is in the public space where people have to go to, it is somewhat of an idol, like a collective standard. But if the statue was moved and placed into context with possibly some insight or summary or story behind the object, then it can become a learning tool. I mean, I’m not gonna get too upset, you know, but I’m just saying we don’t want to become extremist only for the other side to entrench themselves and have an existential fear. Like what I’m saying is, slavery might be over, but racism and all these isms still exist. It’s all just misplacing blame and ignoring the class war. And let me correct myself. Endentured servitude is not over. Slavery still exists in the United States, and it seems it’s coming back, but it’s hidden and veiled In language, and low pay. Like I think we should move past all this in a way and just acknowledge that there is a class of people who use criminals around the world and domestically to manipulate us and get us to doing things that are against our own best interest as they get high on the hog.
But if the statue was moved and placed into context with possibly some insight or summary or story behind the object, then it can become a learning tool.
I already know you are arguing disingenuously, but the context of the statues is hate. They were mostly erected LONG after the civil war to ensure black folks “knew their place” and to bolster Jim Crow.
All your crowing about “no war but class war” would go down a lot easier if not for your DeSantis-style insistence that we have to pretend all this shit didn’t happen in order to do anything about the shit that IS happening. You are making maga talking points but dressing it up in “it’s all a class war sheeple!”
https://www.history.com/articles/how-the-u-s-got-so-many-confederate-monuments
I’m just saying we don’t want to become extremist only for the other side to entrench themselves and have an existential fear.
Oh, well, we wouldn’t want Republican voters to show us just how awful they can really be, would we? They might elect a despot who will run the country into the ground, dismantle our infrastructure, and run roughshod over the rights of US Citizens.
Further, anyone who sees the OP reaction to the burning of a plantation and feels their “side” has been aggrieved by that reaction is accidentally telling the truth about what “their side” actually stands for.
The handful of statues that are actual civil war era artefacts we can keep, imo. Put them in a museum or an exhibit in a state park or something. Give it proper context, but let it exist.
The vast majority of them were built after the civil war in the jim crow era south, and those we can break into gravel and use for something fitting.
Regarding confederate statues, I believe the only place they should be… is in their cemeteries. They should remove them from public lands and place them in the cemeteries.
This plantation house was used as a resort, so that’s a little off putting, and glorifying the history instead of being a sobering reminder of atrocity. I would have rather it be given over to the local government and turned into a museum against slavery. But, even then with how much the south glorifies the confederacy, the state wouldn’t have done a good job showing the evils of plantations like this.
Agreed on the second part. I don’t understand why anyone would want to sleep in a place like that.
But I disagree on the first part. Should all be rubble, imo. Glorifying the traitors just set us up for the current situation since the plants that have grown are just as rotten as the root imo. The only reason the man got office is because he co-opted the movement that’s been in play for at least 60 years by the likes of turtle-lookin fuckbag McConnell. Remember the Tea Party a few years ago? All of this is a culmination of years of effort by the right wings to push out progressive ideals. Trump just took advantage of the hysteria and pushed the GOP old guard out and set him up as narcissist supreme.
Remove the reminders of the old days as physical locations, imo.
No the statues are almost exclusively post civil war by like 50+ years. This house is an actual contemporary and iirc still has some of the slave quarters on property from when it was still a museum.
People used that house for celebrations and weddings, not to remember its history
Amazing show of empathy
Kudos for cutting out their names but I do love that they included “#BurntToACrisp”
where is that?
It’s on the FB post that is cut off here. The uncensored version is floating around BlackSky.
Edit: I missed that this isn’t the FB post. Someone took their picture from FB and reposted. But this is on BlackSky with the ladies names and a couple hashtags, one of which is “#BurntToACrisp”.
Good question, I just read the article and couldn’t find it either
I don’t like this as a “stick it to em” thing. Personally, I want to see those women own that entire plantation, and transform it into a haven for the black community. If that means tearing it down, so be it. I want them to own that shit. I want the slave owning twats to be rolling in their graves over, not just a black person, but a black woman owning their shit.
That said, amazing selfie lol
