If I can ask a noob question in this highly philosophical and technical thread— what’s your intended client experience for Beehaw? I’m using Voyager on iOS and will be sad to lose it if Beehaw migrates (or even doesn’t migrate to v19), though there may be a similar client for one of the other platforms under consideration.
Surely y’all aren’t all using a web front end, right? It seems there may be value in choosing a platform that has community support for clients as well as mod tools.
The lemmy devs don’t think they need to do anything because they don’t think transphobia is a problem. They don’t care about giving you effective mod tools because they don’t think bigotry needs to be stopped.
We see this shit time and time again. This nonsense faux “free speech” commitment and just general unwillingness to allow people to create safe spaces if they choose is endemic to new platforms, communities etc. that simply don’t care to put in the work because they aren’t personally bothered by the issues. New mods always act like it’s a virtue to “let the community figure it out” even when 1 or 2 people cause outsized issues.
All of this is to say I believe in the beehaw vision and will gladly follow y’all where you go.
Yeah, I’m getting very sick of these “free speech” types. Like, I don’t want to create an echo chamber, but, seriously, we don’t to hear the goddamn Nazi point of view. Platforming that sort of thing normalizes it. Mainstream platforms won’t even permaban stochastic terrorists like LibsOfTiktok. In fact, social media platforms carry much of the blame for the divisiveness in society these days. That’s why the Beehaw project is important. We need to show the world that there’s a better way to do things. That it’s possible to disagree with someone without being at each other’s throats, entertaining dissenting opinions and perhaps reconsidering one’s stance on things, and growing as a person by widening the pool of experiences one is exposed to. For example, I used to be a vague “libertarian” type, but my position has evolved to the point where I’m a left-wing anarchist now. People can change for the better. Again, I’m not saying we should listen to the ultra right wing’s point of view, but I bet there’s tons of people out there in their own little bubbles who have never left their homogeneous communities and have never heard the stories of the marginalized. We may not be able to change everyone’s minds. But if we can change some, well, that’s a win for all of us.
I don’t want to create an echo chamber, but, seriously, we don’t to hear the goddamn Nazi point of view.
I’ve been avoiding comment on most of this thread because I really don’t want to be seen as the instigator even more; however I wanted to comment on this specifically. Absolutely agreed with you on this point. I utterly hate the go with the flow, echo chamber style of discussions. I mean sure, if you’re talking about how to make chocolate chip cookies, there’s not really that many different ways to do it. Your recipe, will echo mine, for the same results. But in a lot of areas in life, there really are a lot of different takes. Your experiences and views and other nuances shape your ideas and expression on any given topic. They won’t be the same as mine. And if they are, and all we talk about is 100% stuff I agree with; well, I ain’t learning a damn thing am I? I’m just reinforcing my stance. Conclusion shopping. It is really important to have a different point of view that can be well explained and defended across the spectrum of what that may be.
There is no defense for treating people (human beings) as lessor than you because you disagree with their existence. Be it Nazi’ Transpobia or otherwise. That’s not a difference of opinion. That’s a fundamental difference of what it means to be human. There is no echo chamber telling some wanna-be dictator POS’ Nazi sympathizing fuck, to fuck off.
And then THEY bring friends and the friends bring friends and they stop being cool and then you realize, oh *****, this is a Nazi bar now,” he continued. ”And it’s too late because they’re entrenched and if you try to kick them out, they cause a PROBLEM. So you have to shut them down. - Michael B. Tager
If 10 people are sitting at a table and one of them is a Nazi, then you have 10 Nazis.
Beehaw wants zero of those people, echo chamber be damned.
Are there enough admins and developers fed up with Lemmy to maintain a fork?
A fork wouldn’t help anything at all, the problem is that nobody is working on the patches not that the devs won’t accept them
I haven’t commented on anything in quite a long time, but I’ve been checking in now and then and I just wanted to say that wherever Beehaw goes, I’ll be following. Really immature behaviour from the Lemmy devs.
Really immature behaviour from the Lemmy devs.
IKR? I’ve been working with developers for 30 years now and I’ve never seen this level of egregiousness. In my opinion, the Lemmy devs are way out of line here.
I have. Check the story of how Linus (the one from Linux), changed the way he approaches suggestions after his old ways drove some guy to commit suicide… over a patch that he didn’t commit (how’s that for dark humor).
Lemmy devs sound like pre-selfconscious Linus.
I always appreciate how much thought, effort, and time you all put into these documents and the community and everything; thank you from the bottom of my heart. There’s no place I’d rather bee, and whatever direction ends up being taken I’ll gladly come along.
There was an event I used to go to every few months. When you got there, you’d head up to the registration tent to check in but the first thing said to you was always “welcome home!” and the second was “do you like hugs?”. That’s how it feels here, like walking into a tent of people who care that you’re here because they want you to share in the positivity they’ve found.
There’s definitely something about walking down a trail in the woods carrying a bunch of gear a mile or two when suddenly you start running into hippies coming the other way, welcoming you home and telling you you’re almost there. And then it becomes trail-side camps, and then the big tent.
I think I need to go find a council. :D
Not trying to belabor this analogy but I’ve been thinking about what you said all day and:
You’re totally right, but every, every interaction I’ve had with another bee feels like they’re the kind of person who’d turn around right after walking past you on the trail and say, “you know, I forgot something back there. Can I help you carry anything?”
And I’m completely here for it
Running an instance myself, the lack of mod-tools is very frustrating for quite some time now. I totally agree with pretty much all improvements beehaw suggested in the past to solve these issues. It’s a shame how this topic is handled…
