- cross-posted to:
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- cross-posted to:
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Thanks to the commenter who reminded me that it’s not bad to be reminded that the term is only a pejorative because conservative racists made it so.
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If you’re not woke your eyes are closed
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Waving your hands and saying “woke is not an insult” will not stop it from being used as an insult. But we can counter by using MAGA as an insult.
yup. but it also takes away their power when they’re like “you’re woke!” and you’re like “oh, you really think so? that’s wonderful”
yeah if you can pull it off but tbh it’s probably not going to go as well as you might picture it in your head.
no for sure. it’s a two prong attack of counterpropaganda. the first is responding immediately by saying MAGA or MAGAt like its a hateful term (easy, it is) but the other prong is within our own circles reminding ourselves that woke folk get shit done and it’s a good thing to be
I feel like there’s a pretty big set of center-to-left people for whom the positive notion of wokeness is spoiled by particularly egregious behaviour of, say, “woke Twitter.” (for instance, I suspect many are eager to move on from “mansplain.” And let’s not forget people bullying Lindsay Ellis for comparing Raya and the Last Dragon to Avatar; that was fucked up.)
If we can deftly arrange for “woke” to redirect to that kind of peripheral stuff, and extract the important stuff – protections for minorities, diversity and inclusion, etc. – under some new label, then yeah I’m content to leave “woke” in the past.
1000% correct
Isn’t woke used ironically? People who are ‘woke’ are not woke, but ignorant.
I don’t recall seeing it used that way. What I have seen is:
Positive: being woke is being aware of social injustices
Negative: conservatives use it as a slur to mean anything positive that involves people who are not white men
Ironic: calling normal everyday things woke, like taking showers or wiping your ass
Isn’t woke used ironically?
Short answer: No.
Long answer: nnnnnnnmmnmmnmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmnmmnmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmnmmnmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmnmmnmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmnmmnmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmnmmnmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Being woke means being aware of the societal injustices in the world. The opposite of sleeping on something
“Stay woke” means “keep paying attention”
Which is why it’s hilarious when the right says they’re anti-woke. Like a child who thinks the monster goes away if they cover their eyes
The term is a classic instance of “double speak”. Twenty years ago, the running joke was of Libertarians calling anyone who still supported the idea of a federal government “Sheeple” and insisting that they needed to “Wake Up!” and come around to Ron Paul and Ayn Rand’s point of view.
Ten years ago, “Woke” was a liberal term describing people who recognized the chronic threat of police brutality and state prosecutorial bias towards minorities.
Three years ago, the ultra-reactionary Houston pastor Ed Young launched a Church Awake campaign to counter what he believed was “Woke Culture” in the city.
The Atlantic’s columnist thinks it is when you are obsessed with policing language. The ABC’s columnists think it means being an educated black progressive. The Heritage Foundation thinks its when you manufacturer grevencies like checks notes the existence of slavery, I guess? The Kentucky AG thinks it means when transgender athletes are allowed to compete in high school sports.
What’s it supposed to mean? Everything and nothing. It’s a term of enlightenment and a pejorative seemingly both at once.
Everything and nothing.
It is in many a tribal signifier, and you’re going to get different stories about what a tribe is like from its members and from its enemies. It’s not that different from “Democrat” or “Republican” in that sense, although at least both Democrats and Republicans usually agree on who is a Democrat and who is a Republican.
The meaning is actually pretty clear. Being “woke” means being aware of social injustice, specifically the systemic racism in US society. Being anti-woke simply means that you outwardly deny said systemic racism but in reality it means you’re condoning it.
Being “woke” means being aware of social injustice
From the left-liberal perspective, sure. But Libertarians and far-right theocrats have also employed the term as a positive self-descriptor, insisting that they had a more enlightened and historical view.
Being anti-woke simply means that you outwardly deny said systemic racism
Racists have employed the term to mean they blatantly reject the history put forward by liberal scholars. It’s a form of political denialism, not unlike climate change denial or holocaust denial.
The irony is in how reactionaries will embrace the term and its synonyms positively - Dark Enlightenment, Great Awakening, Objectivism, “Wake up Sheeple!” - to imply they’re the ones who truly understand the victims of state persecution (inevitably, rich white cis/straight men).
When did we decide that the worst people in the world get to decide what words mean
It’s just how linguistics works I guess.
La la la lava
Reminder that woke was originally used as a positive term.
What’s amusing is that the Wikipedia article traces its origin back to the Republican Party.
Also a reminder that woke is used negatively by the same people who cannot tell the difference between badly photoshopped letters and a gang tattoo.
I think it’s wild that the word ‘woke’ entirely replaced the selective outrage on the 2010s over “CRT,” a bogyman that most white conservatives still cannot define.
My stupid ass: “why did the conservatives have an issue with Cathode Ray Tube TVs?”
Because super smash brothers is woke
Fuck yeah it is.
Lol, yeah that was constantly the problem I had back then, especially since MAGA was using “CRT” as the scare word, and not nothing to mention that it means “Critical Race Theory,” a phrase well in-line with other subjects in other fields, like Biblical Critical Theory.
See also: politically correct (PC) and social justice warrior (SJW)…all just fancy ways to call someone a commie pinko bleeding heart socialist. The Red Scare never really stopped, and neither did the Lavender Scare
That was depressing. I knew our president was dumb, but I still didn’t think he could be that dumb.
I struggle to understand how you guys in the US missed the signs. I mean… stuff like “they are eating the dogs” should sparkle some doubts, right?
Still is if you aren’t a twat
I honestly don’t see people using “woke” positively these days.
That’s because most of us just call it what it is: empathy.
But they’re trying to make that a pejorative too now.
Nowadays I prefer the term “correct”.
Not really. It was just another fart sniffer word some groups liked to use.
No reminder needed for me, but for those who might want to do a deep dive:
I wince any time someone says something like “Wake up!”, “Take the red pill!” etc.
It invariably means “Start believing the shite I believe”
Petition to rename Twitter again, to Twatter. I know, I know, my intellect is frightening sometimes. /s
There are people who have not called it Twatter from day one? Huh…
It’s been Xitter (pronounced “Shitter”) since the rebranding
I will deadname that shit till the day I die! Or not, I honestly can’t be bothered to give a flying fuck, truth be told …
It’s easier too. You don’t gotta constantly be vigilant for the next way the woke industrial complex is trying to indoctrinate you. Because they won.
They go me already. We’re doing unisex bathrooms? Ok then. Eighty new variants of pride flag just dropped yesterday? Well there’s a lot of new colour combos I’ll forget in 30 seconds but alright. Pronouns can be wholly silent, like the P in Pterodactyl? I cannot comprehend how that works but sure it literally will never affect me in a negative way.
That would be a good print for a t-shirt.
You could choose to be neither.
Participating in culture wars manufactured to drive social-media-engagement isn’t obligatory.
That’s a shit argument that casts aside billions of human beings and their rights as such. And your follow-up is even more trolly? Fuck off.
“Choosing to be neither” is choosing to be an ignorant twat but too afraid to own up to it.
👆This👆 is how they view the entire non-hegemonic wprld. They admit it.
Or, I understand that there’s no neutral position when the options are freedom or oppression. If you’re ok with oppression, you’re not a neutral observer, you’re a supporter of oppression.
If you’re ok with it, at least have the stones to admit it instead of pretending you’re neutral.
Doesn’t really apply to a flame war tho.
The right know they can’t win the economic argument. Everyone’s purchasing power is going down and living standards are stagnating.
That’s why they push the ‘woke’ stuff and divide the workers. It’s common sense. Why else would right-wing platforms like Google,Facebook,Newscorp be plastered with this “no neutral! You have to pick a side!” shite?
Doesn’t really apply to a flame war tho.
I’m not talking about flame wars, I’m talking about real world shit. You know, the shit that’s actually behind the behaviors they call ‘woke’ to try to get people to stop doing.
The right know they can’t win the economic argument. Everyone’s purchasing power is going down and living standards are stagnating
Yep, and they use the ‘woke’ shit to make people be ok with worsening conditions because wanting to be treated like a real person is ‘woke’
That’s why they push the ‘woke’ stuff and divide the workers
People push the ‘woke’ shit because it’s a thought terminating cliche that allows ignorant twats to not think about why they’re actually being awful to people or supporting people destroying innocent peoples’ lives
Why else would right-wing platforms like Google,Facebook,Newscorp be plastered with this “no neutral! You have to pick a side!” shite?
What? They push the woke bullshit, or actively support the oppressors. If anything, they take the neutral position so they don’t have to justify supporting oppression when they can pretend to be neutral.
What? They push the woke bullshit, or actively support the oppressors. If anything, they take the neutral position so they don’t have to justify supporting oppression when they can pretend to be neutral.
i was gonna say something to this effect. big tech firms aren’t pushing woke anything. they’re the most anti-woke shit out there. they want us isolated and divided so we never learn our true power as a populace. if this poster keeps drilling down this insane “woke people are just as ignorant as fascists” bullshit i’m going to block them because their entire argument hinges on assuming white usage of a Black term is correct when it is overtly and intentionally incorrect.
but what else would i expect from a
.mlposter. it’s always performative leftist outrage trying to shut down anti-authoritarian thought rather than contributing anything meaningful or useful.big tech firms aren’t pushing woke anything. they’re the most anti-woke shit out there.
Yeah, I was meaning more the ‘woke narrative’ shit. The tech firms are working hand in glove with conservatives to push the narratives that get ignorant twats all riled up about ‘wokeness’. I updated that part for clarity.
Nope. One side are Nazis, dude. If you’re not opposed to fascism, got some bad news for you…
Cool fallacy & us-them/with-us-or-against-us bias, bro.
Do we need our reading checked? Choosing neither (as they wrote) doesn’t mean choosing fascism: it can still be opposed.
Oh boo hoo.
Have fun in your Nazi bar
Have fun reinforcing fallacies & calling everyone who calls out your irrationality a nazi to achieve that optimal circlejerk. Self-confirmation bias is quite a rush.
I have no idea what the hell you’re even on about, dude.
But, no, if you do not oppose fascism, then you damn well do enable it. Whether you likes this or not doesn’t change the fact that it’s true. So go whine about your your moral high ground or where the hell you’re on about as much as you want.
But since you are honestly sounding like you are attempting to defend fascism, I’m going to go ahead and permanently ignore your dumbass now…
Who’ve been the most successful opponents of fascists historically?
And who’ve lost their countries to fascists?
what are you saying? because it reads like you think nazis are anti-fascist which is WILDLY out of pocket so i’m sure you’re trying to say something else, it’s just not clear what
Who has historically defeated fascists?
I don’t think that’s a hard question to understand.
woke folk. but you’re out here saying being woke is neither good nor bad. so… what are you saying?
when did woke folk bayt Nazis?
nazi germany doesn’t get overthrown without resistance movements working tirelessly to fight for their rights back. french resistance, german resistance, italian anti-fascists, polish resistance, jewish resistance, and ukrainians who chose to liberate the concentration camps rather than make use of an opportunity to seek independence from moscow were all critical to allied victory in europe in 1945. and as is often the case in history, as soon as that was done, other oppressive forces such as stalin and the liberals of western europe sold out these freedom fighters installing a new world order of oppression. but we’ve continued working to get our liberation. you can discount our historical contributions all you want. it doesn’t change the fact that the world only gets better when people who know the world is fucked work to get it unfucked.
I guess the idea is that if you’re spending all your energy being anti-MAGA then you aren’t focussing on the real struggle (class warfare). But of course one can focus on class warfare while still being anti-MAGA.
I absolutely agree. And, the shit part of it all? It’s been going on for pretty much all of recorded history (class warfare, that is).
Edit: To clarify my position a little, I see choosing MAGA as willfully submitting to the parasitic “elites”.
tbh I kind of see both of the US parties as submitting to parasitic elites. I think MAGA is much worse for other reasons though.
Well, I agree. However, I do not think opposing MAGA in any way implies supporting Democrats.
“MAGAt” works, too, FWIW
what does the small t stand for?
just to lend MAGA the sound of “maggot”
oh. Eh, they didn’t need to change “woke” to make it a bad word, so I just use MAGA as-is derogatorily.
Bonus Points! That li’l “t” can be voiced with just breath alone as a “swallowed” or “glottal” fricative, (like the S. London “innit”, etc.) for added & effortless effect whenever thinking/reading “MAGA” — aloud or to yourself. It works every time.
Every single MAGA idiot = MAGAt. There are many, many kinds, colors, stripes, shapes, sizes, etc. They’re all maggots, though. And they might be known for devouring mountains of shit by the throatful, but they’ll eat you too without hesitation.
Secondly, though? Let’s do us all a favor and not use anything they do as a model of rational, much less good practices, hmm?
“They” didn’t change “woke” because “they” don’t change fuck all. Their minders tell them what to scream & froth over, and their psyops’ flipping of “woke” is to target anything that doesn’t come directly outta their Führder’s prolapsed Putin-holes. Full stop.
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I’m fine with ignorants and some twats, but not both at once.
Saying a person is woke is like saying they are not a mindless sheep going through life asleep at the wheel.
But they call people on the left sheep? How can this be true? /s
Yeah seriously I’ll never understand how it’s an insult. Conservatives call having empathy “woke” and I’m like “yes, yes it is woke. Your point?”.
it’s basically everything you need to know about them
I agree that wokeness is more enlightened than ignorance, but I also wonder how woke it is to scorn the less enlightened so hard.
I’m sure someone is somewhere grappling with that.
Since the politicians they support and voted in are actively dismantling the government, erecting a dictatorship, and enacting policies guaranteed to get people needlessly killed I don’t find myself burdened by such concerns.
The point isn’t to take sides with the sheep, it’s about self-awareness. Recognizing that hating ignorant people is just a different form of ignorance. We’re all burdened by or own ignorance even if we don’t know it.
I don’t hate them for their ignorance. I would actually stop short of saying I hate them at all. But the deep disdain I feel for them is for the hellscape they have dragged all of us into, and which will take decades to fix, if we fix it at all.
So yeah, I’m probably burdened by being ignorant of how that makes me just as bad as they are.
Considering I’ll die of old age still being harmed by what they have empowered and are currently cheering for, and will also die knowing my kids’ lives and the lives of everyone I care about will be worse because of it, I’m ok with that.
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“Drawing Bayesian inferences after extensive sampling, I’ve determined that it’s 99-percent certain that anyone who uses ‘woke’ as pejorative will turn out to be a fuckhead. Please don’t blame me for pointing this out—it’s just science.” — Mike Godwin
So conservatives version of this is their deweaponization of the word nazi? Fuck this timeline.
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it.” - Joseph Goebbels
The word Nazi was weaponised then overused against people who where not in fact Nazis. And now it no longer means anything. Congratulations you played yourself.
Nazi said what?
If their is anyone I would trust as an authority on how to convince people to be Nazis it would be gerbils.
Doing exactly as he suggests is a very poor idea.
So that video the other day of that woman blaming the Jews for being holocausted weren’t nazis? And to ad this is a view I’ve witnessed firsthand from only conservatives.
That woman defiantly was a Nazi. But calling people who don’t believe what she does the same thing makes calling her a Nazi effectively meaningless.
Classic boy who cried wolf scenario. And now the real wolfs get away with saying fucked shit.
That would be because its conservatives who it is weaponised against. Who would expect that.
During the holocaust there were millions of Germans who were completely indifferent to the killing of the Jews. They were likely unconsciously ignoring the horrible shit that was happening and didn’t want to face reality because if they did acknowledge it they would be implicated or be shunned by their in group. Notice how their main concern was selfish in nature. This is how I see the landscape of modern day conservatism. There is little to no pushback from other conservatives against the horrible shit people are saying and doing.
So you can argue all you want whether or not the wilfully ignorant are nazis or not I don’t really care. And I am not surprised it’s meaningless to those who are indifferent. They have already chosen to ignore the horrible shit some conservatives are saying, why would they care what anyone else says.
I would say the mass outcry from conservatives at trump not releasing the Epstein files is the exact push back u refer to.
And this is why the left keep losing. The right are not ignorant of the shit the more extreme than themselves are doing they let it be because for the moment their goals are aligned. The left is too busy fighting with others on the left over what flavour of left they are and to what extent that they are. They end up completely sabotaging themselves fighting to be right instead of to win.
Then of cause u need to remember the only law that exists is violence and he who wields it wins. The conservatives have won the young men and the left are apathetic to their struggle. The left does not realise the threat they have created.
You have just proved my point. Conservatives will rather “win” than call each subgroup out on their disgusting behaviour. This isn’t a motley crew, it’s “decent” people mixed in with hateful dangerously ignorant people and there is an indifference that will bring in a new era that will be shameful if humans get beyond it.
Well u better get used to losing cos being right doesn’t mean jack shit in the face of overwhelming violence.
